Should dogs be allowed in bars and restaurants?

No we don't. If the pub or eating house allows dogs, then that's just tough luck. They have to eat somewhere else.

 

Guide Dogs in training in the UK don't get their vests until they are six months old. But we carry ID cards at all times for ourselves and the dogs, so shop/pub/cafe/restaurant owners only have to ask.

The pups don't have any automatic right to entry, it's all on goodwill - but I have never been refused with either of mine.

Guide Dogs are allowed absolutely everywhere except food preparation areas (ie kitchens) and zoos.

 

I'm in Rosemary's camp, I don't feel the need to take my dogs everywhere with me because I spend a lot of time with them and they get lots from me and our family. I also don't think including children is necessary as this is a discussion about dogs being allowed in pubs/restaurants, try not to forget we were all annoying, screaming little whatsits when we were babies/toddlers I also agree with Roger, not everyone likes dogs, maybe frightened or have phobias, therefore thought and respect for others is necessary. I don't particularly like having dogs in an area I eat in, I don't let my dogs into my kitchen at home when we are eating so I don't much fancy it when I go out to eat. Just my personal opinion x

 

oh you're mean Helen not letting the dogs in the kitchen when you're eating - Juno's normally curled up on my feet and has been since day 1

 

Ours sleep under the table when we are eating

 

WARNING! RANT!

I think kids are very relevant to the discussion. I think there are a LOT of similarities between kid lovers, and kid haters, and dog lovers, and dog haters.

I don't have kids - because I dislike them, and find them extremely annoying (I wouldn't wish them any actual harm, you understand )

I have to put up with kids in endless situations in my life wherever I go - I can smile at mothers with prams who think they own the street, clutter up lifts with dratted buggies, slow down hoards of commuters because they are holding several small kids on the tube escalators, kids slobbering and throwing food around out of high chairs in restaurants, pulling at coats and my dog's tail (!) with sticky fingers (yuk!), screaming, making a noise and talking rubbish. I can smile and say "awww....how cute!" and "how old is s/he? Oh, how clever for that age!" and "what a lovely child! Would you like a hand down the steps with the buggy?". I do this because I don't want to offend anyone, don't want anyone to feel uncomfortable, and just think it's a nice way to behave. It's called being tolerant of others.

So, people can do the same for my dog - who is a great deal less annoying, frankly! Or take their business to a place that chooses to ban dogs - of which there are many.

 

Hear, hear @JulieT .

 

Agree with you @JulieT and I had 2 children but they had to have manners and sit at tables in restaurants, not throw food, scream, shout and run around etc. etc. My birthday dinner was less than perfect last week because of a family group with 5 children aged between 2 and 8 who caused mayhem in the restaurant and yet everyone is always to frightened to complain about the behaviour to a parent or the restaurant come to that and yet my dog is not allowed

 

I'm happy for dogs not to be allowed but would then choose somewhere that I could take him if I wanted too. As long as he was calm and behaving himself, the same as I expected and got from both my children. The rule with my children was, they were to sit up to the table and eat nicely, no running around at all. The only difference with my dog would be that he wouldn't sit up to the table but lay down under or beside it .
Definitely down to the choice of the owners of the cafe/restaurant or pub.
We need both so that everyone can make a choice.

 

I have 4 children one with Autism, I have taken them worldwide, they behave because I insist on it and I have been complimented many times on their behaviour on planes and restaurants etc. They are human beings, dogs are animals and there lies the difference. People should to be tolerant of each other very young and old, but I don't feel I should have to share my eating space with an animal and I love all dogs a lot Not ALL children behave badly. I wonder how you all behaved as little children, not very well I wouldn't mind betting but as we get older we tend to forget that, you may have been that annoying, screaming child that threw food and ran around annoying other customers

 

Well, I disagree.

It's not about humans vs animals. It's about your tolerance for what I want to do (take my dog places) and my tolerance for what you want to do (take your annoying child places). Plus, get real, I always compliment people on their children - that's just polite - even if I think they are brats (which I invariably do).

Your position is that I have to tolerate children yet you do not have to tolerate my dog. I am being tolerant of you by tolerating your child, and by removing my dog. What are you being tolerant of?

And, I have yet to meet a parent that doesn't think their child is well behaved - yeah, right. Anyone want to own up to having the totally annoying child? No? Yet they are to be found in every pub on a Sunday....

 

I disagree

You are comparing animals to human beings in an eating area, I do not feel I need to tolerate dogs in an eating area. I am not one of those parents that think their children are well behaved because I am realistic and honest. Why can't owners leave their dogs at home? You can't leave young children at home as you might well be arrested

 

Well, interestingly, I think that in England you are less flexible for children than in Scotland.
Several times travelling "down South" we have ended up at a "family pub" that would only serve up to a certain time (is it as late as 9pm, not sure it is) because of licensing laws? So we have had to go to a chip shop or carry out for food rather than a restaurant.
At least if a pub or restaurant is "dog friendly" it tends to be non time restricted.
Unlike some of the "child friendly" places we have tried to eat.
It takes us foreigners a while to adjust to your English customs you know.

 

Just what is the disadvantage or hygiene risk in my dog lying under my table while you are eating several metres away at your table? It's just your preference. Nothing more.

Your position is simply that I must tolerate you, yet you must not tolerate me. I know you don't feel that you have to tolerate dogs - but, thankfully, and I hope it remains the case, that where I'm allowed to take my dog - that's your tough luck.

 

Before 2003, there were English law legal restrictions on minors being in pubs - since 2003, it is completely up to the owner of the pub although there are restrictions still in places where under 16s are unaccompanied by an adult.

 

There is no hygiene risk to having dogs in a restaurant. Anytime I've become sick in my life it's not been from contact with a dog, it's been from contact with a human. And yet restaurants allow humans, and they allow those humans to eat from plates and put utensils actually in their mouth (!!!) and then reuse those plates and glasses and utensils for other humans!!! Compared to that, what is the risk from having a dog lying under the table?

I think that dogs should at least be allowed in outdoor dining areas. If establishment owners allow dogs indoors that is great. I loved going to pubs in the UK and seeing dogs lying quietly under the tables. I don't remember a single occasion on which a dog was doing anything other than lying quietly. You barely know they are there.

Small personal rant: I would like to ban children from bars and pubs because those are adult places and children diminish my enjoyment of being there. If I had a bar or pub only people 18 or over (drinking age here) would be allowed. Though babies who are not yet able to walk far might be ok. Basically, ages 1 to 18 are banned in my hypothetical bar. Dogs of all ages welcome.

 

Exactly. Mother comes into the office having taken a day off (I'm not allowed a day off to take my dog to the vet...) with a story of a child with an ear infection...I share papers with her AND GET AN EAR INFECTION! Kids = a walking bundle of germs.

And I don't complain about kids! I smile, and I'm pleasant, and I don't write letters in purple ink trying to get them banned from pubs. Even though I think Rachel @Oberon is being generous in allowing them at 18 back into her pub....I'd say 25 is when they start being worth interacting with...

 

I think because we live such a restricted life of dogs not being allowed in so many places I dream of this and am looking forward to taking advantage in the Summer.However I have a 3 year old now who has very limited experience of being allowed in human social places........so the reality may be that he can't cope that well with it and so we won't be able to do it.......I'll be giving it a really good go though!Our pit stop drinks and after walk pub meals might be less relaxing and more about training sessions though....AND anywhere I go will be with the mind that I might not be staying if he is disturbing the peace!

 

This an emotive subject, so thanks for keeping it friendly guys

If I ruled the world (…..) well behaved dogs would be allowed anywhere. And so would well behaved children. Although I have quite high standards when it comes to the definition of well behaved

I think one issue here is people who don't have the ability to effectively teach their dependents (human or canine) the appropriate way to act in public. Teaching Learning Theory at school would perhaps go a long way to solving this.

 

Along with critical thinking and how to evaluate evidence!! (just dreaming now )