Excited! Finally found a trainer for Vespa :-D

I've finally found a positive Gundog trainer near Glasgow. Yay! Vespa will have her first session one-to-one in two weeks (time to brush up!) and then join the small class thereafter. Sooooooooo excited-and if Vespa knew, she would be too. ))))

 

That's great!! I hope you both have a ball

 

Simply can't wait. It has spurred me on to concentrating more on her training on my own and reminded me how rewarding it is. She was amazing today. )

 

Enjoy yourself,great you've got a place x

 

Great news, well done! I think we need to see some videos of Vespa in action

 

That's definitely worth getting excited about

 

That's great news a good trainer is invaluable.

 

Eeeerrm..if I knew how to post a video I would! I'll work on that..

 

If you upload it to YouTube, you can just use the little "Media" icon (two to the right of the smilie on the toolbar) to paste the link.

 

Lol, you named your dog Vespa. I love it!!

 

Great! Can't wait to hear (and see) more once you get going! Lucky Vespa!

 

Great news, I hope you both enjoy it

 

Hi.
I still have 6 days till Vespa's training session. I'm trying to prepare but it suddenly occurred to me that even though the trainer says he doesn't use aversives 'apart from tone of voice' he may wish to do things completely differently in terms of commands/general -oh I can't explain what I mean..but let's say for example Vespa's recall is currently 3 pips and he wants to change it to 5 or for stop he does something completely different or-I don't know -his methods are just different. I don't know if I said earlier but Vespa is already 4. She's never going to actually work or do trials or anything but I want her to enjoy it, not be bored, have something we can do together etc. She has been 'trained' by me using PM Gundog training manual for grades etc and only got so far but what she has got is pretty good. I'd really like to add to that using same methods but I guess o can't expect the new trainer to do things the same way. Will Vespa get confused/lose everything? Is it too late anyway because she is 4? It's just for fun but at the same time it would be a shame to mess up what she's got. The trainer for example says he is only uses positive methods but then said he first use food because he thinks labs spit the dummy out if you do. Hmmmm.
Sorry for long post.
Can anyone advise on what to say to the trainer and if I should try to keep her current commands or at what point to walk away etc? I don't want to start from scratch ag this point.
Thanks for your advice in advance!
Will post photos/virus when I have any!
:-/

 

*meanr to say 'doesn't use food'

 

Ok firstly take a deep breath
I doubt that the trainer would just change lots of things all at once. Hopefully they'll be teaching you and you can choose what your cues are. If they want you to change they should be able to explain why.

Now I'm going to be slightly less positive.

Anyone who thinks food causes dogs to spit dummies doesn't understand how to use food properly.
Aversives are aversives and the dog decides what is aversive and what is reinforcing. It's up to you what amount of aversive you're happy with if any and for the trainer to work within that.

Your money, your dog, your decision and don't let anyone tell you different!
There are certainly some concerning things in what the trainer has said. Are they a gundog trainer or a general trainer?

Having said all that I've always learned something from every trainer I've seen

 

It isn't too late to train a dog at 4 years. What is difficult is to undo any errors that have been learned and rehearsed. So, if you have a dog that has chased birds (just for example) for 3.5 years then it's going to be hard to undo that, and have a steady dog. But it's not problematic to train an older dog otherwise.

I do agree with Barbara, if a trainer doesn't use food and uses 'a tone of voice' as a correction, then you are going to someone that is probably a traditional trainer. Which you might be ok with, or not. It's not unusual for more traditional trainers to describe themselves as positive, or not using punishment, but this is because they don't really understand positive training.

 

Yes totally-that's what I had come to understand so far about aversives. Hmm. He is a Gundog trainer but only has his own cockers. He trains Labradors in his class. He also does normal puppy training and says he uses food for them but not for Gundogs. I've always used food with Vespa and she doesn't spit the dummy out at all. I'm also worried because he says Vespa must be 100% steady before joining the class and we would work on that first. I understand how important that is etc but wasn't sure about doing nothing but that 1-2-1 before joining class. Hmm. Maybe I've got the wrong guy or maybe that's normal..?
Could you advise about what I should say to him etc? I'm totally inexperienced. I guess I can always walk away after first session. i was so excited that he said he used positive modern methods that I maybe didn't ask the right questions.
Thanks for your help. Reeeeeeeeally wish I lived near the many trainers listed on gdog club website.
Thanks again.

 

Btw in previous post I said I would post photo/virus hahaha I promise I won't! I meant video!
I can't see without glasses and hadn't located them at that point in the morning!

 

I think it's really tricky. I have valued the time I spent with more traditional trainers, and I did get a lot out of the sessions, but I thought I was upholding my ambition to train without aversives, but I wasn't. I picked up a horrible AH-AH! NO! habit that still plagues me to this day, for example.

I do want to go to some more traditional classes, because I'd learn stuff and they are nearer, but I'm not confident yet in my ability to adjust what I learn to be positive. Plus, I think the way you train is fundamentally different, I don't think you just do the same stuff but try not to use aversives. That said, there was one trainer I went to that used such mild corrections I'd go to him again if I didn't have other options. So you maybe just have to be clear in your mind what is, and what isn't, ok for your dog and go and see. Be wary though, I think it's easy to have confidence in a professional and go along with what they say, when you are stood in a field with them, and then regret things later when you mull it over.....

These aren't all positive trainers though, only some are.

 

Had session today. I needn't have worried so much. (Typical) Having said that the trainer used very different methods so I need to write it all down and have a think about what to do next.
Some of the main things I learned:
My timing is to blame for a lot.
Vespa is a lot steadier than I flight. (Yay!)
I need to be bold enough to move on a bit and take s few risks/trust Vespa more. Thanks to PM training manuals Vespa's foundation is a lot better than I thought. I also found out that she isn't gun shy (I wasn't sure) Very happy.
...plus a whole lot more. Generally I was very, very proud of her.