My 7 month old lab Jessie is a star and is responding brilliantly to everything we're teaching her. At the moment we've been training the Clicker Retrieve but I'm well and truly stuck at the 'holding sit'! - she just continues to drop the dummy at my feet, which of course, in all the previous steps of the training got her a treat! However, now the next step is for her to hold on to it at the end of the sit - but I can't even get 1 second to build on!! I've also tried training this bit separately - I held the dummy and started by clicking for a touch building up to her taking it - but again, as soon as she has it, she drops it!! Jessie is such a wonderful, bright girl it's definitely me that's getting this wrong! - can anyone help?!!
When she takes it do you continue to hold on to it or do you let it go? If you let it go, try gently holding onto the ends instead to build up some duration. Slowly lessen the degree to which you're taking the weight of the dummy. Then begin letting go for a microsecond, then gradually longer. Basically, teach her that she has to kept her mouth on the dummy (but don't add the complication of also taking the weight of the dummy). Once she's got the idea that she has to keep her mouth on it then gradually add the task of also taking its weight.
I struggled with this with my older dog - Charlie - for months. And I honestly wished I had never bothered! I tried endless ways to do it, I consulted quite a few trainers, quite a few times, and ended up training Charlie to mouth the dummy. It was hopeless. I quit in the end, I'd already got a hand delivery, and I just settled for that. It's fine, he targets my hand with the dummy, gives it to me, and that's just fine. Done. No more messing with holds and sits and so on. He'll do a walking hold perfectly, he'll walk and follow my hand for ages. Ask him to stay still with the dummy, it all falls apart. Because of the previous difficulties I'd had with Charlie, I was reluctant to try a clicker retrieve with my new puppy, Betsy. I was just moaning about it to Fiona and Barbara today! @snowbunny @bbrown But tonight, I tried it and Betsy is happy to hold still while I hold the dummy and release on the click. She is just different. I just worked on my hand target, then tossed a dummy and she approached in the pattern of the hand target and was still as I touched the dummy, waited a second, and clicked. (Which is not the same as some instructions for the full clicker retrieve of course). So that works with her.... To be honest, I think you need a bit of experience and confidence with the clicker retrieve so you can adapt it to the dog you have and how they respond. I don't think it is an easy thing to do at all, and slightly despair when it's held out to novice trainers as a cure all. It is pretty difficult, unless you know what you are doing, I think.
It's true. Moan, moan, moan I'm a bit like Julie. I have a fairly strong delivery to hand, a good walking hold and a rubbish stationary hold. Every now and again I think I'll work on it again, but it's just not that important to me! I choose my battles, and I have bigger fish to fry. Sorry, that's not helpful in the slightest for someone wanting to perfect a sitting hold. Maybe take a note from Philippa Williams - take your dog, your bag of treats and a bottle of wine. Work through both the bag and the bottle. By the end of the evening, you'll either have a dog with a great hold, or you'll be too pissed to care
I've trained a few dogs and the easiest way of getting your dog to hold either the dummy or game until your ready is quite simple every time they drop it in front of you take a step or two back and send them back for it eventually they cotton on that if they give you it they are rewarded works for me every time patience pays diffidends keep going you and your dog will look brilliant together and never look back
Hi Sunshine, Have you seen these articles? Totally Gundogs - Clicker Trained Retrieve The link is to an introductory page, which then takes you to four different sections including one specifically looking at holding the dummy
I'm not going to be any help as I've been trying to train a sitting hold ( in order to compete in obedience) for weeks now. Molly will retrieve and hand it to me but as soon as I ask for a sit she drops it. I've been working at the clicker hold but can't get beyond a second at most. @Maddog67 if I step back when she drops it she'll pick it up again but drop it once more as soon as I ask for a sit - then after a few goes she gets bored and wanders off! My obedience trainer told me to make it more fun, let her chase it and turn it into a game of tug but all that did was spoil the really good steadiness I had. ( I already played tug and sit was also the release cue for that.) Sorry OP, no help but if you find a solution I'd love to hear it.
If you're training an obedience retrieve you will probably need a sitting hold but if you're training for fun or to work your dog it's really unnecessary and the sitting hold I trained in Riley has fallen into disrepair I haven't bothered with Obi. The behaviour I actually want is a firm delivery to hand - that's it. Many, many dogs find a sitting hold difficult. I back chained it with Riley so he was sitting and I gave him the dummy but as @Oberon described I didn't let go or give him the weight of it. Gradually giving him the dummy and weight and then for longer periods before asking him to pick it up himself. You may find it easier to use a marker word if you try this way as juggling everything can be tricky,
@Sunshine We've suddenly had an epiphany today - Molly has started to hold the dumbbell for 10 seconds in a sit (she might have held it longer but I took it from her not wanting her to drop it). She did this numerous times in a row. The only differences today were that I had different treats ( cheap Lidl own brand instead of homemade liver cake!) and, crucially I think, that I haven't trained at all since Wednesday and she came to me to initiate a game. It shows that it will work if we keep going, and that perhaps it takes a bit longer than we expect. I'll look forward to hearing how you get on.
I have never been to bothered with sit at delivery. But with Kira I decided to have a go. I did not use the clicker, just asked for sit and gave her the dummy, as soon as she took it. I said 'hold' and then immediately 'give' and reward with a treat. The important thing is getting the hold, a second will do to start. Then extend the hold, this takes a few goes. Also giving the treat too soon can get a drop, if the dog drops the dummy walk backwards and encourage the pick up and follow you. But most importantly the retrieve has to work, if they don't retrieve to hand whats the use of a sit and hold? When working more than one dog it is nice for them to hold a bird until you are ready to take it, but I find they will not drop a bird anyway.
@Joy I was trying to find your thread about how you ended up training the dumbbell hold. Can you remind me of your method? Pretty please
I clicker trained it basically the same way as this site describes training a dummy retrieve. Every step of the following was repeated lots. I sat Molly in front of me, clicked for nose touch, clicked for mouth touch, clicked for hold with me supporting it, clicked for taking full weight for briefest moment, gradually extended time. At this point I tried putting my hands above my head which seemed to encourage he to hold. Then I put dumbbell on the floor and asked her to pick it up, but kept my hands above my head until she sat. Lastly moved on to thrown retrieve. It took a long time -several weeks - but she is very good now and never (famous last words) drops it. I've been searching for the trainer I followed online but can't find it or remember her name. I found her videos encouraging because she had very fast-learning collies but also a giant breed who was much less quick to grasp it. The video showed the whole learning process, not just demonstrating the final achievement. I'll have another hunt later and see if I can find it.
I too am trying to get my lab to hold on to the dummy. She will hold it then try to pull it away from me then lie down and chew it! Clicker is helping her a bit to bring it to me and drop it in my hand but not every time. Outside she will run around with it before bringing it back and dropping it at my feet. So gone back to basics in the house where she wants to chew it. Have followed the videos of the collie who seems perfectly behaved! Any ideas?
