My black lab will be two in Jan and has had a total of 3 seizures since July. Two were real ugly to watch, one much milder. He has been on Phenibarb for two week. What can anyone share with me their experience with this.
Welcome to the forum Sue. Sorry you are having these issues with your boy. @MF is a regular on the forum and has a fair bit of epilepsy knowledge, but several others on the forum have experience of seizures too. If you search "seizure" or "epilepsy" in the search box at top right you might find some helpful threads. Jac
Hi Sue, Sorry to read this about your boy.It must give you such a fright when it has happened. I haven't any experience myself but I'm sure other members will reply ,there's a lot of knowledge and support within the Forum x
I'm sorry to see this. My black lab BJ was epileptic, started around 3 years. A long story but without going into it all here, he finally died at Christmas aged almost 14 and a more loyal and affectionate dog you couldn't wish to meet. We'd have him back tomorrow - epilepsy and all. Am more than happy to tell you our experiences if that would help, either here on the open forum, or private message if you'd rather. Good luck with your boy.
I have had a German Pointer who was epileptic. I find vets are not necessarily up to knowing much about it, my vet was good enough go to a lecture given by the PFFCE to gain more knowledge. Do join the Phyllis Foundation for Canine Epilepsy, they are very informative, helpful and supportive. I cannot praise them enough for all the support I had and for the knowledge. When my dog was first on phenobarbitone, he was very unsteady on his feet for about two weeks and I was all for taking him off it, however, I persevered and he returned to normal. Between fits he lived a very happy life and could do anything. Watching them have a fit is distressing, but with medication (not just phenobarbitone) he should be able to lead a long and happy life, the fits less frequent and with correct balance of medication, he may go long periods without one. Do let me know how you get on.
We've had this with a previous dog, a Labrador cross. The first fit was very distressing as we had no idea what was going on. Over time, and with medication, the frequency of fits stabilised. We started to recognise the signs (Gypsy would start glancing upwards as if there was something on the ceiling). When we saw this we knew that it was time to get her to a safe, dark, place so she could have her fit. Afterwards she usually needed a few minutes to recover so we wouldn't disturb her. Then she would empty her water bowl as fitting made her thirsty. The important thing that we learned was that, in between fits, she was a perfectly normal dog and lived a normal life. The hardest bit was getting her to take her pills. We tried to put them in with her meals but she would find the pill and spit it out. In the end we wrapped them in cheese, ham, fruit and all manner of random foods then watch her for a while to make sure that she wasn't hiding it in her jowls. I guess we had about a 90% success rate as we still found the occasional pill on the floor.
Hi there Sue and welcome to the forum. My dog Poppy had one fit back in February, and - fingers crossed - has not had one since, so I know how distressing it can be. Hopefully now with the medication your boy will not have a repeat, or at least not so bad. What is his name?
Hi @SueG I am so sorry to hear your boy has had seizures. For us it was very frightening to watch but worse was wondering if Snowie was in pain or frightened because he whimpered during fitting a few times (broke my heart). Thankfully he seems really well now and the worry that he might have a seizure has reduced incredibly -- previously I would be terrified most of the time that another one was brewing. He only ever had seizures at around 4am -- the vet thinks possibly due to a drop in blood sugar at the time and the changes in cortisol, also at the time. Only once did he have a seizure at a different time. He's had about 8 seizures in his life -- starting at 1.5 years. He is now almost 5 years old. Snowie is on Potassium Bromide (KBr), a very old drug -- been in use for over 100 years. It is better for the liver than phenobarbitone, but can cause renal problems, hind quarter weakness, and pancreatitis. It also takes a while to reach therapeutic levels, but in Snowie's case he wasn't having frequent seizures, so we had time for him to reach the therapeutic level. Pheno apparently has a far more immediate effect and can reduce seizure occurrence more quickly. Snowie had KBr toxicity probably due to his low salt diet (raw food), which caused hind quarter weakness (and who knows what else!). We now test him every 6 months and thankfully his levels were fine at the last test after reducing the dose dramatically -- the vet actually thought we were overdosing because of his high blood levels. The problem we encountered is that the vet didn't seem to take into account his raw diet (even though we told him about it), because salt levels definitely do have an effect on KBr uptake. Anyway, this doesn't affect you, but what I can say is this: Make sure you are your dog's best advocate because the vet is seeing hundreds of dogs and might miss something with yours. So you need to be armed with lots of questions for your vet and monitor your dog well. Snowie had seizures for two years before we medicated him. He was only having one every 4-6 months and our vet said it was better he remain unmedicated rather than face the side effects of the drugs. But when he had two seizures in two days, she said he must be medicated. We then went to a specialist physician who recommended the same. I was worried Snowie would change, become a different dog. He did go a little crazy in the first two weeks, due to the medication. The vet recommended reducing the dose and he came back to normal. Except that he had a ravenous appetite. Before the meds he wasn't a typical Lab -- he'd eat till he was full. After the meds, well, he is permanently hungry! It has taken enormous willpower on our part to resist the hungry eyes. Another problem is that he is now attracted to the slightest whiff of food and will race off in search of food -- recall is usually impossible in these situations. Something we have had to learn to manage. On the plus side he seems to be a much happier dog! I know, Labs are the ultimate in happy. But it seems the drug calmed his brain and he is now able to relax and enjoy life far more. Also, the drug seems to have cooled his body. The vet said that anticonvulsants have the effect of cooling. Snowie used to be an incredibly hot dog -- his skin would be fiery red, which we put down to allergies. He is still allergic, but much, much, much cooler now, and finally his skin is a nice pink. If he remains seizure free for two years we can wean him off the drug. He was doing really well (7 months seizure free) until we gave him a Bravecto. Thereafter he had two seizures within 6 weeks. Not sure if it was the Bravecto, but not taking a chance again because he does seem to be sensitive to flea/worm meds (had a seizure immediately after taking a Milbemax). Since then he's been seizure free -- been another 7 months. When he wasn't being medicated for seizures the tell-tale signs that he would be about to fit were the stink of his anal glands (apparently they fill up when a dog is frightened, and apparently it is frightening for the dog to anticipate a seizure). Also, he would have discharge from his penis and also appear to be a bit "out of it". His anal glands no longer fill up since he's been on the meds, but he does sometimes get discharge from his penis, and one wonders if indeed the meds are stopping the seizure from happening even though he might be on the brink of one. Giving him the meds is really easy. It's liquid and tastes vile (I tasted it!). We were really worried how we'd give it to him. Well, he LOVES his meds! After breakfast he comes racing inside and sits drooling for them (um yes, he never drooled before commencing with the meds, but seems that the increase in appetite caused by the meds has also caused the drooling). He gets 1.4ml in mashed sweet potato. The easy thing with KBr is that if you forget a dose, it doesn't really matter as the blood levels take a long time (about 3 months) to change. Also, you don't have to be spot on at the same time each day, and they only have to be administered once a day. If you want to know more, please say so -- am always happy to share our experience (as you can see from this long post!!). I remember how frightened I was, and so sad for my poor boy. But that has all passed and life feels quite normal now. Hopefully Snowie feels normal, too! He definitely is still a character and his personality has not been altered by the drug.
My poodle had epileptic seizures, but I don't think as serious as yours as he never needed meds. The vet just explained to me what was happening and how to care for him after an attack and that was that. But he was also only 5 lbs. so much easier to simply pick up and hold during an episode. Afterwards he'd be kind of out of it for an hour or so, during which I'd just keep him safe and warm in a blanket. Every once in a while he would be "out of it" when I didn't notice a seizure and the vet thought that too was a result of a mini-seizure. If it helps, he lived a long life and was otherwise healthy. He was a devil dog, but that was nothing to do with epilepsy!
Thank all of you for your concern over my big boy Zeke. He's 83lb and full of energy and joy. He takes his meds without any problem and will be checking blood levels soon. I've been giving him Nexguard for flea and tick control and have been reading that this could be contributing to seizures.Will ask my vet about this.
That's interesting about the Nexguard - please let us know what your vet says, I'm very interested. Big pets to your Zeke, he sounds like a lovely boy!
I was chatting to someone who used the spot-on treatments for fleas and ticks (I don't recall which brand). Her Boston Terrier had seizures for the first 6 years of her life. For some reason she stopped the spot-on treatments and the seizures stopped, too, and the dog went on to live a long life seizure free. This might've been a coincidence of course, but I have read concerns about pesticides, particularly the ones that are ingested, and particularly in dogs that are prone to seizures. We do continue to deworm Snowie because he eats raw food and when he had his first seizure he also had a tapeworm infestation. We only use Mediworm now; thankfully it doesn't appear to cause ill effects. We no longer use anything for fleas and ticks except an anti-tick spray (no pesticide, just a repellent) when we go to a tick-infested area (carrying biliary) for a holiday. We are lucky that we appear to live in an area that doesn't have fleas and only the odd tick after the spring rains. We are very careful about checking for ticks -- Snowie has a white coat and it is very easy to see a tick crawling on him before it has attached. The repellent we have works amazingly well although it does smell awful! It is worthwhile reading the inserts of any meds you give to see if they say a side-effect is seizures or not recommended for dogs prone to seizures. Regarding supplements, we give Snowie a Magnesium tablet every day. I have read that Magnesium has been used in human epileptics with good effect and my vet was happy for us to give that to Snowie. We also give him Salmon Oil capsules (omega 3) for inflammation (he also has allergies, but apparently also good for epileptics). Regarding diet, human epileptics have been treated well with a ketogenic diet. (From Wikipedia: The ketogenic diet is a high-fat, adequate-protein, low-carbohydrate diet that in medicine is used primarily to treat difficult-to-control (refractory) epilepsy in children. The diet forces the body to burn fats rather than carbohydrates.) We don't go as far as a completely ketogenic diet, but we do limit the carbs in his diet and feed him raw meat and raw meaty bones. Excess protein can be converted into sugars (among other molecules -- it's been a while since I studied physiology and don't remember all the details!), so we're not feeding exactly a ketogenic diet, but it is definitely a lot lower in carbs than a diet based on pellets. Of course what we feed him in his bowl and what he scavenges are two different things!! He has gobbled up dropped sandwiches on the pavement, so there goes our ideal of a low-carb diet! Best of luck with treating Zeke. When Snowie had his first fit I thought we were all alone. Sadly there are many others. You are not alone.
I am very, very sorry to have to report that Poppy had two seizures on Saturday. The last time was the last day in January, so nine months ago. It was really scary and horrible - luckily I had the diazepam the vet gave me in February and was able to administer it. The first fit was long (around seven minutes), and the second shorter, but pretty much straight after the first one. I am so sad that this is happening to my beautiful girl. Jac, Bravecto was never mentioned as a possibility, as her last seizure was at the end of January, so four months after we had given it to her. This time is also two months after she last had a tablet. But to be sure, I will not be giving her Bravecto again, and will investigate the scalibor collars instead.
I am so sorry to hear. Just devastating. A piece written about Bravecto by a retired doctor (I must clarify, not a vet) mentioned that delayed reactions (like seizures) can occur due to possible liver damage and the recommendation was to get blood tests to check the liver. Bravecto is designed to remain in the system for 3 months.
We had all possible blood tests done in February; they showed no liver damage. But maybe those tests will have to be re-done.
