Hello All, I am brand new to this forum and pretty new to Labs also. I have three dogs, a mini Schnauzer Madison, a black lab named Kane (10 months) and a yellow lab named Lucy ( 9 months) My pups are at the dog park at least two times a week. They are at our local park daily with me and off leash along with other people who have their pups too. So they all are pretty well socialized. With Lucy I rescued her about 4 months ago from a bad situation. She was removed by animal control from a severely neglected environment. She was left locked 24/7 in a kennel. She was made to use it as her den and toilet. They also kept a shock collar on her 24/7 to the point she had horrible sores from the prongs when she came home to me. And she was also severely under weight. She has been doing fantastic with us. She took right to Kane and wants to be Madison's friend, that is still a work in progress. So anyways today when I took her to their normal dog park a male puppy around the same age came up to great her. She automatically stopped playing and hid behind my legs. Then the puppy pounced towards her in an effort to play and she attacked him. She has never shown one ounce of aggression. I moved her to another empty area of the dog park, but the rest of the time she was on guard. And if any dog approached the fence line in an attempt to greet her she sprinted back and hid behind me. She has never been like my other two who run to great all the new people and pups entering the park. She more or less ignored them, but tonight she was scared and wanted to hurt this other pup. I am not sure what happened. I was thinking maybe is she about to go into heat and it is just a side effect of that? Any help is appreciated with this!
Hi there, and welcome to the forum! And thank you for taking on Lucy and giving her a loving home. It is so sad to hear of what Lucy has been through. My first thought on this is that you are perhaps expecting too much of her at this stage. She as been through severe trauma, and as much as we like to think everything is ok now that she is in a better place, the reality is that her horrible experiences as a young pup are bound to have affected her. I would stop taking her to the dog park for now. It's too much for her, from what you describe. And it's really not necessary at this point. You have two other dogs at home, and she will have enough socialization with them, for now. How is she with them? Having an approaching season will also be an upheaval for her. The best for her would be to have a calm, safe place, which you can provide for her st home. I'm sure you are in close contact with a vet, but a visit with a trained behaviourist might not be a bad idea, just to help you understand what the lingering effects of her initial environment might be and some ways you can help her adjust. I got my dog when he was around the same age as Lucy is now, and I found it surprising how long it took for him to settle in with us. It was probably about six months before he relaxed with us completely. All dogs are different, but perhaps Lucy might have more adjusting to do too. Hope this is helpful, please don't be afraid to ask more questions as they arise. We'd love to be kept updated as to how Lucy is doing.
How great that you have given a loving home to doggies in need. Lucy behaved like that because she was frightened. She was telling the other dog to go away because she found it very threatening. I would say that she did not intend to hurt him. She just wanted him to go away but he wasn't getting the message. I'd say that she has very limited experience of meeting new dogs. Being at the dog park was already probably a bit stressful, and then the other dog persisting in coming up to her kind of pushed her over her ability to cope. Plus there was maybe something about that dog or it's behaviour that reminded her of something that had been a bad experience in the past. I'd say that the best approach for now is to avoid putting her in situations that might be too much for her. I wonder if you can maybe for a while just visit the dog park at times when it's likely to be empty apart from your dogs. Or give her chances to meet other dogs that you know are friendly and sedate, in territory that is familiar to her. Will she take treats from you at the dog park?
Hi Lisa! Thank you for the great response! Lucy is absolutely wonderful with my dogs at home. She is the docile one out of them, actually none of my dogs ever show aggression to one another. I work from home with them so they are with me all day and we are all very bonded. I did notice the other night I had Lucy out front of my house playing ball. We live in a rural area surrounded by fields and woods so we are playing out there almost every day. I also have neighbors who have a laboradoodle that is a year old. He came out and wanted to play with her, but she automatically ran and hid behind me again. My neighbor restrained him since she was scared and he never approached her fully. So she didn't get aggressive with him. I don't want to cause any lasting trauma for her, more so then she already had early on. So I think I will stop the dog park for now since we do have tons of area to move and run off leash. And yes I am going to call my vet today. She is also a dog herding trainer. So hopefully she can give me some good advice. I think maybe I didn't realize the extent to which she has experienced trauma and I am pushing too hard for her to be happy. I will slow down a bit with her and see how it goes
Could you describe more fully exactly what Lucy did? Did she bite the rude puppy? Hurt him? Persist in biting and hurting him? Was the puppy afraid after and avoid her? You say the puppy was around the same age, the same size too? How big is the dog park? I think it's really encouraging Lucy runs back to you, she seems to already see you as a safe place and her protector. But I agree it's maybe too soon for the dog park. How could you know that since all before went so well? But Lucy's reaction would indicate to me that perhaps she'd be better off with only a few dogs she and you know. Some dogs really are happy just to be with their owner. Labs are usually pretty gregarious but if Lucy just wants to be with you, you might have a very good potential dog for all sorts of training like agility or obedience where most of us deal with the distractions of other dogs that you might not face. Lucky Lucy to end up with you.
Hello and welcome. You are doing an awesome job with Lucy . Is she spayed or perhaps she could be coming into season ? In my experience bitches can be very out of character and grumpy prior to starting...then they mope about a bit....then they become all out flirts. ! Her life experience no doubt plays a part but could also be hormonal. I am sure your vet will be supportive. Best wishes Emma and Meg.
Welcome Angela and your furry family from Hattie 9 years and our rescue boy Charlie 6 years. What a big heart you have to have given Lucy a loving, safe home Poor little girl sounds like she has been through a terrible time and maybe her experience at the dog park was just too overwhelming for her as she has practically spent her life locked in a crate, she doesn't know how to react . Taking all her training slowly will help. You could try some clicker training which helps dogs grow in confidence, builds bonds and is good fun for owners and their dogs. Lots of information on the forum to get you started if you fancy giving it a go. I wish you luck with Lucy, she sounds like a lovely girl. xx
Hi and welcome. Also congratulations on taking this poor little pup into your home and life with your other dogs. As you say it sounds as if she has experienced a very impoverished, cruel early life which unfortunately can lead to some ongoing behavioural issues whigh with love and careful management can be overcome or managed to help her lead a happy healthy life. The cause of her reacting in the dog park is most likely a fear response to the strange dog or a misreading of body language or even a response to something in her past of which you are unaware. It may be worth having a consultation with a behaviourist who is fully onboard with all the positive reward based training,.and make them fully aware of her past history. They will able to advice you on strategies to help your girl.
Hi! Thank you for the reply! I was not wondering if she could be coming into season or not also. I honestly have never dealt with a female dog that wasn't fixed. Both my schnauzers were fixed at 12 weeks if I recall correctly. My vet will not touch her until she is a year old. She said if she did it too early it will hurt her bone growth with her being a big dog. I am completely new to the realm of big dogs and I had no idea how different it actually is from little ones! But I am totally loving it
Hi! So Lucy is very active and very focused on her tennis ball pretty much all the time, but especially at the dog park. The male dog(a little smaller than her) entered the dog park, which was the only other dog there with us, my black lab and schnauzer ran to greet him. I have noticed that with Lucy since day one she never makes any effort to interact with other people or dogs, but she is never unfriendly either. So her and I kept playing. After the other dog finished greeting my other two he ran straight to Lucy to greet her. She automatically started growling because he was pouncing up and down at her trying to get her to play. She backed up between my legs and kept growling. I was trying to restrain her and get the other dogs owner to come get him. He didn't act concerned and his dog came right up to Lucy's face and she bit him. But she released him and kept growling and lunging like she was trying to just get him back from her. Then my black lab( he is goofy) thought it was a game and he jumped on Lucy like he does at home. I think she was so frightened she got confused and bit him too. But I screamed and I think she realized who she was biting and automatically stopped. After that the owner said he would leash up his dog and take him to the other end of the park. It is three acres so there is quite a bit of room. I calmed her down and she wanted to play again. Then I see out of the corner of my eye he released his dog and he is charging across the park right at Lucy again. She ran back to me and hid. He jumped on her again and she bit him until I pulled her off and physically carried her out of the park. She must not have been biting him to hurt him because I don't even think she broke the skin on him. I didn't see anything at least. I think you might be right about a dog park being too hard on her. The more I think back to all the times she has gone I realized she always heads straight for the back of the park with me. My other two take off to socialize, but she never leaves my side. And if people approach and want to play with her she walks away. She also will never play ball with any other dogs other than her brother and sister. If a stranger dog jumps in to play with her, she will stop and refuse to play. I didn't think about her feeling stressed out. I was watching her today when we were out playing in the woods. She was so confident and happy. She is a totally different dog with just us then she is when she is forced to socialize. I hate that for her, but you might be right about her needing to just be with us.
Hi Angela, Lucy sounds like she is doing really well considering what she has been through! Dogs are often very subtle in how they communicate, and it sounds to me like Lucy not making any effort to interact with people or dogs, and walking away, is her saying she is uncomfortable, and it is great that this is her first response. I would agree with the others who said that the dog park is just too much for her to cope with at this stage. My boy is very friendly with other dogs now, but when I first rescued him he was very uncertain with certain breeds of dog. What we would do is that if a dog he wasn't sure of started to approach us, I would say "come on then let's go", turn around, and just keep walking away until the other dog gave up. If the dog kept following us, I would make sure I was between them and just kept slowly and calmly walking away. This way you teach them that you are in control of the situation, and if they are nervous they should just stick with you and you will protect them by taking them away from the other dog. If you just stand still, and the other dog is right there, Lucy will feel that she has to do something. Maybe she will never be very sociable, and that's ok, but this way she will learn that you will handle the situation, and she doesn't have to protect herself. You are right, if she really wanted to hurt him, she would have! Lucy is very lucky to have found you!
From your second post I think Lucy showed a fair bit of restraint. She tried to tell the pup to back off and he wouldn't. She didn't have much choice but to escalate to a bite and as you describe it wasn't even a hard bite. And it phased the other dog so little he came running back later. Her biting your own, other dog is understandable too, in the confusion. I'll give you a link to one of Suzanne Clothier's articles describing how this is normal dog behaviour and not aggression on Lucy's part. More like defense actually. However it will probably happen again at a dog park so I still think dog parks are not the place for Lucy, there are too many overly friendly dogs all crammed into a small space. I think three acres is pretty small. You were lucky, that seemed to be a pretty good other owner, the pup's owner. Lots would have given you grief for your dog biting theirs. http://suzanneclothier.com/he-just-wants-to-say-hi#.WLLjgPkrL1c
Hi @Angela P I've just been reading your post with more details of your girl growling and biting the other dogs. While the behaviour certainly seems to indicate a fear response to the other dogs approach and the dog ignoring her warning, it is a response you don't want her to use as her preferred date behaviour. There is a risk that her response will escalate more quickly from the growl to the bite as the growl didn't work and then go straight to bite without the growl warning and the bite could even become harder. The dog park is definitely the wrong environment for at the moment and a good behaviourist consultation would give you a plan to help reduce the strest and help relax around other dogs.
