My puppy is terrified of other dogs. ALL other dogs. When he was about 9 weeks he met our neighbour's little tiny miniature something (mixed toy breed). She is about 9 years old, half blind, can hardly walk, and was in no way threatening to him. She stands about 25cm high. He didn't like her at all. He went utterly insane and he was terrified. We let them just be free together in the garden but he just kept running off and hiding inside the hedge. He has met dogs in the vet at 10wks old and again this week. He caused absolute mayhem in the vet over another dog who was in there. A very old and couldn't-care-less Boston Terrier. Good friends of ours also have a lab, she is now 5 months old. When my pup was about 10 weeks old, they met, and the 5 month old just wanted to play and was quite rambunctious. My pup was absolutely terrified. They met again last week and again today and my dog goes crazy, barks, freaks out, runs away (I have to keep him on the lead because he WILL run off). He is scared and hides between my legs (I ignore this, I don't comfort him or anything) and the other owner just keeps her dog on the lead- Her dog is yanking to get closer to mine and she is physically pulling him back, mine is trying to run as far as he can the other way, shaking. Today I asked her to let them come closer (she does not like this behaviour from my dog) and her dog jumped on mine (i feel it was just playing) and my pup was really upset. My pup's mom rejected her puppies at about 3 weeks old. She was sick with mastitis and could not nurse them past about 3 days, and they tried to encourage her back with the puppies but she refused and had nothing to do with them. The breeder introduced the puppies as much as possible to his other 2 adult females, and his two female puppies, but in the last 10 days before we picked our pup up, they had an eye infection in two of his dogs and he had to keep them all away from the puppies so that it did not spread. So they really were not socialised with dogs very well in the early weeks. We don't really know anyone else with dogs - our friend with the lab is finding everything quite overwhelming and she is finding it very stressful that my dog is so scared of her dog. So am I, tbh, but my point is that I don't think that socialising my puppy with theirs is the best first step. What is the best approach? We don't have dog parks here, though we do have parks where a lot of people take their dogs. They need to be kept on a lead at this time of year. I can try a puppy class but I am worried it will just cause mayhem having so many dogs around. Is that the best thing to do? It's not my favourite option because most of them you have to pay for 10-12 lessons in advance, and most of them are quite unimpressive from the first read of their websites. Or should I just keep taking hi out to where there may be other dogs and hope that he somehow "gets it" in time?
I don't know the answer @Kobe, given your puppies early history. I get what you mean about having to pay up front for classes. But I wonder if you could find a +R trainer and/or behaviourist in your area who could help you? Perhaps he needs a little friend who is his age and size?
I wonder if the vets could give his details out to any one coming in to give their puppies their jabs? To set up some managed puppy dates?
We went to drop in "puppy socials" where they had similar size and aged puppies supervised play. Puppies were required to have their first set of shots. I see them advertised at quite a few training centres...might be worth checking out and calling to see if they could help manage some short meetings one on one with other young puppies?
Ok I just found one place that might be good, though it is a lot farther away then I want to drive but hey! It's about 40 minutes each way. They have a puppy play group. there is a small breeds group, a large breeds group and a mixed group. I think the mixed group might be better?? They have a puppy playground with teetering boards, ball pits, tunnels, piles of logs, tall grasses, etc etc. And lots of puppies. I will try to get him there this weekend. I'm scared he will embarass me!
I would take it very, very gently. Lots of treats for being around all the puppies. No forcing him to interact with them. If he seems overwhelmed then move away. Given his early history you may need professional help to help him along.
So we went today, and really did not like it. All of the other puppies were great and my puppy was doing okay. But there was one pitbull terrier there who was literally attacking - not playing - with the other puppies. Properly pinning the puppies down and going for their neck while the "victim" pup cried and tried to get away. He eventually got hold of our puppy and my husband went to grab the pitbull's harness and pull him off. My dog was crying and hysterically trying to get away. The trainer pulled my husband's arm away and made him stop. She said they were only playing and we couldn't separate them until one was hurt?!! Pitbull got my puppy's ear in his teeth and growled and yanked hard and my puppy yelped so loud. She said NOW you can separate them. Is that right??!! Clearly not one of the puppies was playing with the pitbull. The other tussels and snipes between other puppies were definitely puppies playing, it is clear to see the difference. The pitbull was hurting them and none of the puppies liked it. But when my pup jumped up on someone, and the man petted him I asked him to not pet until he sits, else he thinks jumping is okay. I was about to make him sit and the trainer came up and shoved a bit of hot dog in his face. I said he's not allowed hot dogs (he's on a special diet right now) and she said she wasnt planning on giving it to him, it was just to lure him to do what he was supposed to do. Once he sat, I could give him a kibble. I said he does not need a lure to sit, he simply needs to be told. And that I don't believe in teasing him with something he cant have and that I am not going to give him. We ended up arguing about it. It really upset me. My husband and I both speak with a thick accent although we are both fluent, aside from an occassional grammar slip. She kept repeating this to us saying obviously we did not understand her and looked for a translator. We had to say bluntly this is not a language problem, we just disagree with you. She said as a dog trainer she knows what she is talking about!! There was not much time with other dogs, then we had to go to her "socialization" activities - a ball pit, a slide, a bench to walk across etc. My dog did not do the bench perfectly (ramp up, across bench and then walk ramp down). He jumped off the side before the bottom ramp. I gave him a treat because he did not want to go up in the first place and did great. She said he didn't do the entire thing so he shouldn't get a treat. I'm more of the opinion that next time you make him do a bit more, a bit more every time. No? Anyway she also tried to get us to rub our kibble in cheese so it would smell better because it would make him do what we want. Am I being crazy to not be happy? Is this how it is and I have really wrong ways?
I took my pup to a socialisation class a couple of weeks ago and I have to say your experience does sound very off to me. During my session my pup and a golden retriever both got a bit excitable playing with each other (nothing remotely aggressive) and the trainer immediately (and calmly) got us to separate them to calm down a bit. She was always very good and patient with all the dogs and her training methods were very consistent with a lot of the methods I've read about on here. I certainly wouldn't have been happy if I had been to the place you went to.
Oh my goodness my heart goes out to you and your pup... The puppy classes I went to couldn't have been more different, there were barriers, like gates, between the 'puppy stations' so the pups could see each other but not touch. If a pup got over whelmed or over excited then a blanket was put over the gate to reduce stress. We controlled when they could greet and it was all kept very calm. I hope you can find something better, and a more enlightened trainer
The first thing that I would say is 'trust your instincts'. If it doesn't feel right at this class and with this trainer then don't feel as if you have to go back. At the end of the day you have to do what is right for you and right for your puppy (who, especially at this young age, relies on you to help him out in difficult situations). I still think that mixing with other dogs will be good for your puppy but I wouldn't return to this class - bad experiences will only make your task all the more difficult. Try to find a different class or even just an appropriate one-to-one with another dog of the same age. Where are you based? You never know, there may be another forum member in your area who may be in a similar situation. And as for this ... ... pretty much anybody can call themself a dog trainer - it does not, in some cases, mean that they know what they are talking about.
Sounds awful. Can’t you form a small group of 6 nice dogs that you meet regularly? And find a trainer to work with you 1 on 1 and who has all their attention on you? I wish I’d gone with my instinct when I went to a horrible school for 1.5 years!!! I thought the problem was me and my dog. When we eventually found a positive rewards only school with max 6 dogs in a class, we made progress in leaps and bounds. One thing I do agree with this trainer is making the treats nice and smelly - your dog will be more interested. I read an interesting study the other day on Science Dog about how smell makes the food more alluring than what the actual food is, eg bread soaked in chicken stock was more alluring than plain bread even though the chicken stock had next to no chicken in it.
I have only been to one set of puppy classes because we have only had Harley but as others have said it was about socializing the pups but also started to teach them how to settle on a mat. So they would be allowed to play but it was carefully watched and if anyone (Harley) got over excited they were gently taken to another part of the space so that all the pups could have a chance to be themselves. There were pups who were more confident and some who were more shy. We actually had two pitbull terriers in our group and they were both lovely, never ever any concerns. The trainer was very attentive so that we could also learn our dogs and other dogs body languages (definitely not waiting till one got hurt) because it is important to understand what your dogs body is saying. But also that all the pups had a chance to learn each others body languages. It sounds like SO much went on in the one class. I would have been very overwhelmed.
Yes I do understand that but at not-quite 14wo my puppy has really only evervhadvhis kibble as treats. Now and again he has a wee piece of roast beef or salmon treat but not often. He will gladly do anything he is able to just for one wee piece of kibble at this age! I don't need hot dog or sausage or cheese to make him sit - in fact he doesn't get any treat for sitting, just a "good"! It was saidin a really condescending way by this trainer - like she is assuming that as a new puppy owner you are clueless and stupid and dont know how to do anything! That annoyed me. She never made an attempt to find out anything about each dog.
I don't blame you. I think it's really important to find a trainer you are comfortable with, mutual respect goes a long way.
I don't think puppy socialisation/classes are good if the pups are allowed to play with each other, it is too overwhelming. I went to a superb class where we all kept a distance from each other. Confidence comes gradually.
It doesn’t seem a good idea to go back to that trainer. Our vet runs weekly puppy socialisation classes where only two or three puppies play together at a time, while the others watch. The nurse who takes the classes always chooses carefully which puppies play together so it’s not a stressful situation. Is there a vet practice near you which has a similar scheme?
Thank you. We have not been back to that puppy school. I am pretty confident with most training and the only thing we wanted her group for was for interaction with other dogs. So never mind! On a positive front, we are making great progress with our puppy and other dogs. We met a lovely border collie pup one day when we were out for a walk and they were the same age and size. They had a wee romp together and it was nice for them both. A few days later I met an old bulldog on the street in our neighbourhood and he stood still and let my dog sniff him and swat at him and he didn't care, which relaxed my puppy. We have met a few others on walks. Yesterday we had a scary but good experience. We met a man walking a fairly old American Staffordshire. They are banned here, only dogs who were registered before 2012 are allowed to be here. Owners and dogs have to pass extensive exams each year, most of the time they are to by muzzled in public unless they have passed an exam that allows them not to be. But it can still be frightening coming across one. My puppy was just licking him and jumping all over him, and he just stood still - that was what scared us, because we thought he mights just all of a sudden snap! In the end he went down with his bum up, and started to become a bit playful but we were both still secretly worried. Anyway, it went okay. Not twenty minutes later just as we were done our walk and heading to the car, my pup went tearing over to a stranger to jump on him and lick his face (his favourite hobby) and the man said his dog would like to play, did we have 5 minutes. Looked in his car and sure enough, another American Staff Terrier. The owner was actually REALLY great, he spoke to us a bit first, calmed us a bit, and encouraged us to let our puppy off of the lead in a field with his dog. He promised that his dog would not run away, and that his dog would not let our puppy run away. We went for it, and it was lovely. They played together really nicely. He is a private dog trainer, without an official "dog school" and he uses his Staffie as a therapy dog, both for people and for other dogs. Never met a therapy Staffie before!! His dog was LOVELY. Such a wonderfully calm and friendly dog, so well behaved and gentle. And my pup loved playing with him. He looks absolutely terrifying though! But he was great. And my pup just had a lovely time. It turns out the man owns a restaurant across the street from our house and we know that we have a mutual friend (but we did not tell him that!). He has told us that any time we want some help, or to work with him, or him to work with us or our dog, to pop over to the restaurant and let him know. We may take him up on it. But it is nice that in just a few short weeks my terrified pup has become a confident and friendly dog lover And without any major socialisation classes or work!
We go to puppy socials on a Tuesday evening. Its nothing like i thought it would be, its much better. A lot of heel work and eventually the dogs do get to meet each other up close, but as soon as one gets too excited they get removed (by the owner, then join again). The 2nd half of the hour is the owners getting together and learning about thresholds and triggers etc. Its great. They have pups, nervous and dog slots. Maybe look for a nervous class if possible? I wouldn't be interested in a class like you described. Even more depressing that your pup was doing really well until one bully upset everything. Someone above mentioned possibly getting together with other pups the same age / size - that would be a great idea if you don't have anything else available. I think same size is important, as Jax was a bit scared of bigger pups at first as they use their paws a lot when playing - he is now the pain in da butt dog that does it - hence at social classes.
