Hello everyone, my black Labrador bitch is 16 months old and still hasn’t been in season, no blood or anything... we also have a 4 year old fox red dog & wanted to get 1 set of pups from them and that’s it, Is this a normal thing? Can their first heat come so late?
First heats can be as late as 24 months/2 years. Are both your dogs fully health tested, with a low COI in combination? Breeding and raising puppies is not an easy undertaking if done well, it is an extremely challenging and very stressful experience(!) which is about as demanding as a full time job. What are you hoping to achieve with this breeding? Is it for performance or show? It is important to choose a stud who complements your bitch and provides the qualities (physical and in terms of performance) which your bitch lacks. It would be very unlikely that, out of all the bazillions of studs available, you happen to own the most suitable one for your bitch...
Yes the dog were breeding her with is everything she lacks in, they make a perfect match, we live in a large farm and are able to take on puppies, we’re keeping a few of them and selling the rest as we just wanted to carry our first 2 dogs on. It wouldn’t be forced. I was just curious if she may be not be able to have pups, which would be perfectly fine.
Having a large farm doesn't mean you should mate your dogs and produce puppies. I notice that you haven't responded to @Jo Laurens questions regarding health tests which should be first and foremost, together with COI for any planned mating together with how you are going to raise the pups to ensure that they are well socialised before going to their new homes. Too many puppies are produced without proper and full health checks or the knowledge to raise the pups.
My next door neighbour is a vet and comes and does all treatment and checks at home to save us traveling to the vets. We have 4 houses on our farm, which have children aswell as ourselves. I breed horses also and do very well in their care, treatments and up bringing. This question was about her heat not to try and put people down about something they want to do. Only wanting one litter, you can’t judge someone on a simple question. We’re well capable, we work from home with 3 successful businesses, a large property and land with a lot of knowledge and understand with animals, I was only unsure about her season as it’s never taken so long before.
What did your vet next door say about not being in season yet ? No disrespect but just curious as to the vet's opinion..
He said when she gets in a time routine of getting up early and going to bed the same time she should settle and go into season but she’s not so I wanted to know other people’s thoughts before she goes and get scanned etc
Annual health checks and vaccinations etc are not the same thing at all. So your next door neighbour, being a vet, has taken the x-rays for both hips and elbows and sent for grading? Has issued a current eye certificate for both dogs? Taken samples for DNA tests to ensure that any pups cannot inherit one of the many genetically carried health problems? You gave researched the COI of your dogs? As a responsible breeder until all these health tests are done with good results your girl's lack of season is pretty much irrelevant.
It is possible that she did in fact go into a silent heat that was simply missed because there was no sign of blood or swelling of the vulva. If this was the case, your male may not have even known she was in season or the signs of his interest were subtle and rebuffed by your female. You could have her progesterone levels tested but that is an expensive route to go... I would simply assume that she had a silent season at around one year of age which would mean that at 16 months she would not have her second season until sometime around the 18 or 19 month mark. While six months between seasons is the "average" some bitches go much longer so it could be later than that even.
There are so many dogs in the world, the only reason to deliberately bring more in (when we are literally killing them every day just because we don't have homes for them), is if they are raised exceptionally well and fully health tested. It doesn't sound like either of your dogs have any health tests done at all. What are their hip scores? What are their elbow scores? When was their last eye test and was it clear? What are their DNA tests, are they Carriers for any of the common problems that occur in labradors? If you breed two Carriers together accidentally, you will create Affected dogs. Have you seen a dog with CNM? Here is one - neither parent had a problem here, both were healthy: Or EIC: These are serious health conditions and you will have absolutely no sign your dog is a Carrier - unless you run the tests, you can breed together two Carriers unwittingly and create puppies that will suffer agonies like these. Vet checks, vaccinations, blah etc - are no replacement for health clearances, but shame on any vet who hasn't told you about them and recommended you get them done before breeding.
I understand where you are coming from. I have already been slammed by the same one who is slamming you. There really are some nice breeders out there...2 of them have also commented on this thread. There are some who simply believe no one should breed but them, and have obviously forgotten they were once inexperienced themselves. Those who are slamming you do have valid points about the testing, I think they simply don't have very good social skills and so everything they say comes off as being better than everyone else; as if you are incompetent and shouldn't be here. Keep on trucking girl. There are some nice, experienced breeders out there. You simply must weed the not so nice ones to get to them. Good luck, get your girl checked (you shouldn't breed her until she's 2, and after her health checks come back clear for her health and the health of the pups), and your boy checked. God bless!
The site encourages informed responsible ethical breeding. No would condone people breeding puppies without the correct health tests. It's not just a matter " of keeping on trucking" it's a matter of ensuring the puppies are healthy and are caperable having good lives. Just because you didn't hear what you wanted to hear doesn't mean you need to behave in a judgemental way. Any good breeder I know would have given the same advice.
From what I gather (any breeders here, feel free to correct me!), most responsible breeders learn by spending time with other responsible breeders in person after spending years involved in the breed, usually showing or trialling, because that's the only way to really learn everything you need to know. Asking isolated questions on an internet forum when there is SO much to learn is just never going to be enough to do this amazing breed justice. EDITED FOR CLARITY: I mean asking isolated questions *instead of* learning from an experienced, quality breeder.
