Just wondering how best to navigate the following: A trainer was working with a family and an adult retriever in our local park, laden with treats and in the middle of a public field. They were teaching recall, and using the 'excited' voice so loud that our lab (who is doing well with training, but still 5months old) and 2 other dogs broke ranks and flew over to the group, and of course all had to be fetched by hand as the stink of lovely stinky cheese was everywhere!! How best to manage this when a human (who is not the dog's human, so possibly over-egging it) is using an un-ignorable and non-specific recall along with treats that just over arouse/excite other dogs too?
Hi DRS1 Use such situations to train your own dog. The other person with cheese is a distraction. Teach your dog a stay cue in the presence of a distraction. Or practise recall. You should have your dog on a long line so that you can prevent her from answering the call of the wild and thereby reinforcing an undesirable behaviour. Prevention is an important part of dog training. Second, learn from the other owner. How is he managing to call his dog successfully in a park full of potential distractions. Take mental notes.
Thanks for this. I had a good think about it - my dog's recall is improving really well too (without faking an ... to get it!) - great to think of the distractions as opportunities to build on it. Let's think about radio frequencies as a metaphor though. If they put human noises for dog recall on the same part of the spectrum as emergencies, excitement, children laughing and injury - aren't trainers asking for problems? We can train in a shared space without such nuisance histrionics and overly-stinky rewards, as I'm doing right now. Amping up the excitement and smells just seems a symptom of under-confidence/over-compensation or un-proven training?
Re your metaphor example, you seem to be trying to justify yours and your dogs behaviour by suggesting that trainer should tone it down. It's like saying people shouldn't use ACME whistles or clickers JUST IN CASE somebody else has trained their dog with the same, and happens to be in the same space As the person above said, your dog flew off to the trainer, that's on you for not having him on long line until you knew 100% that he would recall under all distractions and you wouldn't have to fetch him. Not sure why that's the trainers fault, it's poor etiquette to allow your dog to fly off and approach. Set your dog up to succeed at recall. As for using excitable noises and yummy rewards, your pup is supposed to find you to be the most rewarding thing to respond to regardless of what's around ... if that's cheese/chicken /sprats etc then so be it.
Do have a read up on dog whistles in that context, and maybe pick up on a new thread, but let's not get away from the point. i don't really need to excuse my dog's behaviour, he's young, and learning, and yes, he'll continue to make great gains in recall (which I hope you understand is never 100% in ANY dog, otherwise you're in for a shock). It would be weird to make excuses for him on a forum of people I don't know ... REALLY weird. I'm just wondering out loud whether 'the most rewarding thing' is a bit inconsiderate in a public setting when training dogs far away from the proving stage (and where NO dog is on a line). I'd say particularly so if other trainer/owners don't have the facility to get involved in some sort of screeching contest just because its the easiest training solution, and something I'd use as a last resort.
I dont know how far one gets in thinking about things in terms of who is being inconsiderate. You think the other trainer is causing the problem, he is being inconsiderate. But the other trainer might be thinking, if you were not around with your young dog, then he would not have to yell. It takes two to result in a nuisance. Who is to blame? It is also not clear to me how you think that other trainer should behave. Should he attempt to find every other dog owner and ask them whether their dogs are sound when faced with high distractions. That seems to me to be a very costly solution. Isn't it far less costly for you to put your dog on long line? You know your dog much better than the stranger and can quickly determine a ready solution when you observe what is taking place. Manifestly, I'm looking for a practical solution to a problem that has emerged from the "company of strangers".
I think the two sides are; 1) Trainer and students with first-session dog off leash that has very little recall - dog is not under control, methods are distracting and spoil quiet enjoyment, and the session is for some reason in a central thoroughfare. 2) Various others training in a less-entitled manner - various levels of recall, having to deal with 1)'s distractions. I wouldn't expect anyone to canvas the park for permission, but I'd expect them to use common sense. Like good manners, this costs nothing. My opinion is that over-the-top noises and tempting food are: 1) The lowest common denominator. They are popular methods because they are easy. Easy isn't always best. 2) Pretty much a nuisance for anyone else. We can debate whether nuisance is a team sport another time... The practical solution, is to dial it down a bit or move the session to a more suitable area (there are lots), if you're a trainer worth paying for or an owner who is self-aware, this shouldn't be a challenge, and is certainly the route I take.
