Just wondering where I have gone wrong. Here goes: Maisie is now 12 months old, a working line lab and has quite a sensitive nature. She's not a fan of big cuddles and generally prefers her own space (except 5am in the morning when she has her face pressed right next to mine :), but she is always at my side or in the same room. She has never liked to be examined by anyone since quite early on, but has always managed to stay still and have what ever treatment/exam that was needed. Since I first had her I have spent time regularly touching her nails, ears, etc, she's ok with that, unless she knows something is going to happen to her, ie nail clipping, eye drops, etc. At about 4 months old she tore a toe nail and had to have GA, and was quite stressed when I picked her up from the vet. But the check-ups were ok and she let the vet re bandage her foot, no problems there really. 5.5 months old she was spayed and had a baby tooth out. Again post op visits were fine. 9 months old a visit to the vet for a bad tummy/eye infection resulted in the vet being unable to get anywhere near her in the consulting room and a very stressful consultation. Trying to put eye drops in was a complete nightmare. Whizz forward to last Friday. Vet visit for her loss of fur on her nose: salivating/panting in the waiting room (I even got a cuddle!). When the vet approached her Maisie shot off behind the seats and hid in fear. The vet and I sat on the floor in the waiting room and lured her out with biscuits, but there was no way she was going to let the vet touch her. She did eventually let the vet pet her and tickle her tummy, but anything else was not happening! She now has kennel cough and we have to go back to the vets on Friday! So, what to do? Do I take her to the vets every week for treats and a fuss or do I change vets and try a new environment? How do I get her to trust people and me, and that we are not going to hurt her. The slightest indication that I'm going to do something to her and she is scared. I know whatever needs to be done to turn this situation around will need to be in very small steps! Any ideas or experience of this problem? At a bit of a loss as to where to start as I really need to get this right. Sorry, bit of a brain dump :
Re: Fear of being handled Oh, very stressful. First, I'd say you haven't done anything wrong and Maisie doesn't sound all that unusual - so put that out of your mind. There are a few people on the forum with dog who hate the vet (it might be true to say that these are the more sensitive working line dogs, but I can't be sure of that). I think it's about the dog's underlying personality though. Charlie is the opposite - he went through 100s of painful vet visits and examinations and bounced out of the other side without a care in the world and still loves the vet - but I think that's just the dog he is, it had little do with any efforts I made. I was deeply impressed by one vet I visited in the way he handled Charlie and very sore ears. He was just brilliant and he got me looking for stuff on how vets handle animals. I find the (sadly no longer with us) Sophia Yin fantastic on handling dogs at the vet. If you google, you'll find a lot of tips and articles from her. She has also written stuff for vets themselves (but I haven't bought it http://drsophiayin.com/lsh/
Re: Fear of being handled I think the first thing is to get her more comfortable with being in the waiting room. Though you won't be able to do this until she's had the all clear from the kennel cough You could take her to your vets maybe just once a week or so to start off with and just sit in the waiting room for five minutes feeding her treats, and then leave. Or maybe take her in and weigh her, get the receptionists to give her treats and then leave. Take it slowly. When I have to take Penny I drench a bandana with adaptil spray to help her not get stressed by the other dogs there, you could try this whilst training too as it can only help and won't do any harm. I would probably work on her handling issues at home first of all, in an environment that she is comfortable with and with a person she is comfortable with - you. Does she give you paw? Work on holding her paws for longer whilst giving her a treat at the same time. Can you groom her? This might be a good way to get her used to being touched all over. In the meantime you will have to ask the vet not to handle her and explain her issues and your training - handling from the vet in the early stages could ruin any progress you may make. They shouldn't need to handle her for a kennel cough recheck unless they need to take her temperature and even then that's not really necessary unless she is actually unwell like lethargic etc. They should just ask you if she's stopped coughing, and for how long, have you noticed any snot, and things like that. Is it the actual being handled, or being restrained that she doesn't like? Getting her used to being restrained can be tricky but if she's not too bad with you doing it you can definitley work on it. You can start with things like holding her close to you and then immediately letting go and giving her a treat. As she gets used to this you can gradually build up the time you hold onto her for, and starting working in that she doesn't get released unless she doesn't struggle - this way she will learn to stand still whilst being restrained as she gets released quicker. You will likely need to take it very slowly though and if she starts showing any signs of getting stressed by it then maybe go back a stage for a few days and move on when she is more comfortable.
Re: Fear of being handled Sorry, I didn't answer your question on handling Maisie - I do have some direct experience here, as Charlie got very wary of ear and eye drops being put in at home (I learned the lessons from these before I had to ice his leg after surgery though). I used a clicker for ear drops, I wrote that up once before, I'll see it I can find it.... Sophia Yin again - this example is nail trimming, but there are quite a few examples from her. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWZUcLfHXLE
Re: Fear of being handled Thanks Julie, I'll have a look at that, sounds interesting. I suspect you are right about personality. She's really not interested in people in general, you might get a bit of a waggy greeting and possibly a lick, but that's about it! Which is great as it means she's not likely (usually) to run off and jump at people, unless they have food of course :!! So, thinking about it, why would she want to let a stranger handle her/so potentially painful things to her without her reacting?
Re: Fear of being handled Hi Lauren, thanks for all your suggestions, I have a good read and digest them. Haivng had two sleepless nights the brain is a bit slow at the moment!! She definatley doesn't like being restrained. She's ok with me handling her as long as she's sure nothing is going to happen. I tend to groom when she is relaxed last thing at night. Maybe I should do as you say and start again with that in small step. Lots to think about!
Re: Fear of being handled Hi Debs I know exactly how you feel except my two don't hide from the vet they turn into barking beasts. In fact they turn into barking beasts if any stranger tries to touch them. Scout sounds very similar to Maisie. He's never been fussed on cuddles unless he's tired. Scott though likes cuddles and being made a fuss of but only by people he trusts which are those they met before they were 6 months old. Their distrust of strangers started after prolonged veterinary treatment which went on from 14 weeks old to about 6 months. I've managed to get them to accept strangers approaching and some can touch but I'm afraid the vet is still work in progress although this years vaccinations went a lot better than last year. Like Julie I was going to recommend Sophie Yins website. Maybe if you have a willing vet you could tell them the methods Sophie Yin suggests and ask them to use them with Maisie. Good luck I know how traumatic it is for both dog and human.
Re: Fear of being handled Hi. Maisie sounds just like my black lab from working lines, except she will be 7 this year and still hates the vets and having anything done to her! I try to avoid the vets unless really necessary as she trembles, gets quite stressed about other dogs and people in the waiting room. When we go through to the cons room she jumps on the bench seat, designed for humans, and that seems to be where she feels more comfortable. She is checked over there as it is far too stressful to get her anywhere near the consulting table. I always take treats with me and the vets and nurses are lovely, I know this as I used to work there, it is just the way she is and like it about loads of things. I would say not to get too stressed yourself about it. Jolly her along and take the yummiest treats possible, maybe something she never usually has. Choose the softly spoken and calm vets to see, and I would try to avoid making her stand on the table if the vet is ok about it, for an anxious dog being put up there is just more stress in the situation. If she makes a leap off the table she could do more damage and being eyeball height of the vet can be quite intimidating for them. Hope this helps. Chloe
Re: Fear of being handled Thanks everyone for your advice and experiences with a vet adverse dog! I had to take Maisie back to the vet this afternoon as she is still coughing badly and looked like she was loosing weight. Over the last few days I have been spending time trying out a few ideas given on this thread and just generally spending time holding and releasing Maisie (thank you Lauren), in the hope that we could make some headway before our next appointment. I wasn't really expecting any improvement in such a short space of time, but.......... .....enter the vet! Maisie starts to back away and hides behind me, but the vet is armed with treats and sits down on the waiting room floor and feeds a stream of biscuits to Maisie! Lots of kisses are given to the vet . She's still panting and is very alert to anything that may happen, but what an improvement! I then produce a smelly tripe stick hold it in my hand while the vet examines her throat. A bit frantic with trying to chew the stick, but the throat gets examined and vet provides more biscuits! Next chest....I get the remains of the stick, ask for a sit and hold it up and ask her to leave it! Bingo, she performs brilliantly and is totally unaware that the vet has got the stethoscope on her ;D ;D Lots more biscuits for her and kisses for the vet. Head vet then appears from a consulting room, Maisie looks worried, but lots of fuss, yes, more biscuits : . Head vet goes back into the consulting room and calls Maisie in and she follows her and checks the room out for biscuits. The vet spends 5 minutes with her getting her to sit and wait for treats, etc, which she did brilliantly. Still panting and nervous, but what a difference! More biscuits and an antibiotic injection is done, hurrah! We've got a long way to go, but I'm going to have a look at the Sophia Yin videos and review all the info on here and visit the vets once a week. Feeling a lot more positive and less of a failure! On the health side, Maisie has swollen glands still in her throat, inflammation in the trachea and congestion in the lungs So more Ronaxan for chest, Prednisolone for inflammation, Furosemide which is a diuretic and Marbocyl for trachea inflammation. I think that's what the vet said anyway! = a large vet bill! Poor girl is crashed out on the sofa. Thank you, again, for all your support and advice.
Re: Fear of being handled Oh Debs that's a lot of tablets, poor thing! She must be feeling really poorly But on the plus side that sounds like amazing progress!! The vets you saw sound like they did really well to make it a pleasant experience for her. Keep up the amazing work and I hope she gets better soon!
Re: Fear of being handled Poor Maisie having all those tablets but wow what great progress. Your vets certainly care about nervous patients. Brilliant. ;D
Re: Fear of being handled Does seem like a lot of tablets for a little girl . Yes, I am really pleased with the vets. I think they are worried as to why she is so scared as she wasn't as bad in the past. The head vet was concerned that something may have happened when she was spayed. Who know's, but I'm very happy with they way they are treating, and hopefully it will help towards keeping her relatively calm. I hope!
Re: Fear of being handled Hope Maisie is feeling better soon. What great progress at the vets; it's good to see that they are concerned about her response go them and fe prepared to work with you to make her experience better.
Re: Fear of being handled So glad to hear today's visit went better Harley used to love the vets until she got taken in for an emergency spay. Since then she has basically done the same as Maisie. I started taking her into the vets weekly, weighing her, getting the reception staff to say hi to her then leaving. After a few weeks we started going in the consulting rooms with doors left open. A few weeks later we went into the consulting room (only me and Harley) and closed the door for 5 mins. After this a receptionist or nurse would come in the room, treat her and fuss her then leave. It took about 3 months to be able to get her into a room with the vet and allow them to touch her. Even now, if they go near her tummy she will push herself into the corner I'm lucky that my vets have been really supportive - they are always happy for us to pop in just to say hi
