We have the opportunity to have 2 wonderful spring spaniel puppies but everything we read seems to suggest that it may be a poor idea? My partner and I want to be integral in their training and could take them separately to work each day and train them 'together' but separately. Can anyone advise us on this? All articles appear to suggest that one person is attempting to train 2 puppies and this will not be the situation in our case. Thank you,
Hi Nigel and welcome to the forum. I have two Labs from the same litter. It's definitely not advised and there is lots of information out there saying that you should never do it. I can definitely tell you that it's a lot harder than having one puppy! Now, I'm the one that does all the training, and so my situation is slightly different to yours. The important thing is that they spend a lot of time apart. If they spend too much time together, you run the risk of them becoming too closely bonded to each other and not as close to you. I actually brought one of mine home at 8 weeks and decided later to take the second one (against my better judgement), who came home at 14 weeks, so we had had plenty of time to do initial bonding with the first puppy. Even with all the hard work I put in to keeping them separate, I was really concerned about the prospect of litter mate syndrome; not so much the fact that, according to some organisations, "one of the puppies will never reach its full potential", because I have no aspirations to working or trialling, but more the unmanageable aggression that can manifest. If this does happen, it appears there is nothing to be done except re-home one of them. At 14 months, I'm pretty certain they're past the "danger zone" but I had considered which dog would be re-homed if the situation arose. It was a very pragmatically made decision, but it would have broken my heart if it had happened. You have to weigh up whether you could make this decision, if necessary. This seems to be largely down to luck. We often see another one of the litter mates, who lives in our village and, I can honestly say that if I had taken her alongside my bitch, they would have had to have been separated because their playing often veers towards the aggressive, despite the fact that they only see each other about once a month. Of course we all stick up for our own dogs, but there's something in the other one that doesn't mesh with Willow, and also makes Shadow start bullying Willow, which never happens otherwise. My two do play very rough together, but Annie is a catalyst to unpleasantness. Having done it myself, I would advise against it, although not because it's not possible to raise two well-adjusted dogs. For most people, I'd say that it's just not practical to take the time separately with each puppy and takes more than regular dedication, but in your case, that may not be so much of a consideration. However, you have to be aware that you are taking a big gamble and have to be prepared to give one of them away; I don't think that's fair on yourself or the dogs. It seems that, however much work you put into it not happening, it's largely out of your control. The stories of litter mates ending up literally trying to kill each other are horrifying, and I can see how that behaviour would easily occur between Willow and Annie, even though Willow and Shadow are fantastic together (and, incidentally, Willow is fantastic with every single other dog). Moreover, most reputable breeders won't allow you to take two puppies from the same litter, so you may want to question the motives of any that allow it. In my case, the breeder was a friend and inexperienced; I was telling him about these things rather than the other way around. I wish you luck, whatever your decision and hope you stick around and share your stories with us. All the best, Fiona
Hi Nigel and welcome to the forum As you've already read, the general advice is that it's not a great idea to get two puppies from the same litter. Over the years I've observed a number of people at our dog club training dogs from the same litter, and even when there are two people, each with one dog, and each a couple of hundred metres apart, the normal situation is for both dogs to spend 99% of their time searching for a glimpse or scent of the other dog. It is difficult to avoid a situation where both pups/dogs are waaaaay more focused on each other than you. They can become enormously attached to each other and any kind of separation, or even any effort to get their attention, can be a big challenge (for life). The reality is that it is so much harder. Even with two people. However, that's not to say that it can't be done....with a whole lot of time and effort and a lot of skill and experience as trainers. What sort of background do you and your partner have with dog training? Will these be your first ever puppies? To be honest if your hearts are set on two dogs then get one and wait till that dog is a few years old and then get another from the same breeder (if you are happy with how the first puppy has turned out!). That way you have two lovely dogs from the same family group, but without the enormous challenge of raising two littermates. The older dog will even be a bit of an aid in training the puppy (assuming they are modelling good behaviours!).
I wouldn't for all the above reasons, but also if one pup turns out to a have a genetic problem, the other one could too. You could end up with 2 dogs needing a enormous amount of vet care. Its not cheap and waiting around to see if the other is going to develop the problem is no fun either. Also as the dogs get older they will hit the time when most vet care is needed together. When one sadly dies you most likely loose the other too. Could you cope with the death of 2 of your best friends at the same time? Sorry to sound so down beat but i have experienced some of this and can say its hard and very sad. I don't mind spending over 200 pounds a month on one dog to give him a happy, good quality of life but I know I couldn't afford it for 2. I think what am trying to say is its not just getting to 2 pups its what happens after. Planning is great but life applies the laws of chaos
Thank you so much for taking the time to reply to our question. I will keep you informed but I'm certainly veering to just one after all your comments. Thanks again!
I have two dogs from the same litter. I had one lab for 15 years so going to two 7 week old puppies was quite a shock to the system. They are both male and are now four. They have behaviour problems in that they are very nervous however having consulted a behaviourist they would've been nervous on their own and being together has probably helped. I'd never heard of litter mate syndrome before I joined the forum when my dogs were about two. The only reasons I was told by breeders it's better not to get two from the same litter is difficulty training. I spoke to a number of reputable, well known gun dog breeders. They all recommended a three to five year gap between pups which gives time to train the first one to a reasonable standard and when one dies you replace so you always have two dogs with a similar age gap. None however said they wouldn't let me have two. You do need more time and patience to train two and it's surprising how different in personality they are. From my experience two bitches can have more aggression problems with each other than two males or one of each but again that depends on personality. Would I get two again ? Probably yes but knowing what I now know I'd look more carefully at their breeding and how they were being kept and socialised upto 8 weeks. Whatever you decide lots of luck, enjoy and have fun.
Hi I'm new to the forum and in my initial post I said I would have had serious doubts getting two puppies at the same time had I read this forum first. We really loved our breeder, and he allowed us to visit our puppies quite early. We knew what Chocolate Lab we were to get as he was the only brown male from one litter. The yellow from another litter had six brothers so that was a bit more difficult. However, since we were able to visit every two weeks, we could see the developing personalities and were able to make a decision relatively quickly. The breeder also kept the two boys together for two weeks before we came to pick them up. This worked perfectly for us as the boys lick, snuggle, eat, drink, sleep and play with each other. There was no separation anxiety from mom or other siblings and they showered us with love from the beginning. I stayed home with them so I could be there at all times, They were potty trained within days, responded to their names in less than a week, and basically were learning at the same speed. As soon as we were able, we took them to doggy day care. For some time, they were in different pens as one was more active than the other, but this separation caused them no issues. I guess you could say this was a stroke of luck, but we chose this breeder because we knew the personalities and traits of the parents, and had heard many a good compliment from other dog owners who bought puppies there. They are completely different in personalities, Lucas is laid back, happy and gentle, the other Hudson is a bit hyper, active, and loves to push the envelope. Neither has emerged as the alpha dog so they keep each other in check. The hardest part was the teething stage as all the bites and nips were times 2. We let them mouth our hands and such, but yelped when bites were too hard. Soon they understood the word gentle and now both at 7 months will nip a tiny bit but nothing that leaves any marks or creates pain. I wore jeans in the hot humid summer just to hide all my black and blue marks and to deter them from getting to my exposed skin. Would I get two again? Yes I would. We were lucky too that there were two litters born the same day. The boys are related but not from the same litter, as we also wanted to avoid any genetic issues that might result. So just wanted to bring in another perspective. We couldn't be happier with our "brothers".
We got black lab brothers Jack & Barney at 8 weeks after losing our other two labs within 6 months of each other (there was 2 years between them) We wanted 2 as we had seen how much happier two were together than one on her own. After joining the forum we became quite worried reading all the advice against getting siblings, but it was all unfounded. Our boys are now 17 months old and an absolute delight. They love each other so much, but equally adore every member of our family. They spend the evenings asleep in the living room after their evening walk, but they as often take themselves into separate rooms. We work in the day and have a rota for lunchtimes between hubby/son and a dog walker who they adore. I train them together and separately, but find they are better together, if one sees the other get a treat/praise for doing something he wants the same so follows suit. The only issue we have is that they are unpredictable off lead, separately they are better, but together they just run for the woods with no looking back! We are working on this, and have just found out about a secure dog exercise field that we can hire, exclusive use of over 4 acres for an hour for £10! So we are off there at the weekend, and if we like it we will go every week to crack the recall training. We have just come back from our second holiday in dog friendly hotels in the lake district and the boys were amazing, we ate in the hotel lounge with them and also in dog friendly pubs and they were so well behaved. I wouldnt hesitate to have siblings again, they melt our hearts every single day, but we would start the recall training somewhere secure much earlier - we didn't have anywhere secure other than our huge garden, but its not the same as when theyre out on walks. Just like BontheC above, we couldnt be happier with our boys x
