I'm looking for your thoughts, and some advice with Jake please. We're struggling to settle Jake when he's on his own, and it's our own fault, but now need a plan to help him get used to being on his own for short periods. Let me give you the story so far, settle in, we've chopped and changed our plan a lot When we were planning to get Jake we bought a crate and a puppy pen for him, the plan was for him to sleep in his crate, and be in his pen when we were out. Fast forward to getting Jake, for the first week he slept in his crate in our bedroom, but did have a few poo's in it overnight, and never cried until the deed was done. By the second week his crate was in the upstairs hall, but we never got him to settle downstairs in the kitchen on his own. We tried Jake in his crate, and Misty sleeping in a bed beside him, but again he wouldn't settle, ended up with him free roaming the kitchen with Misty, but behind a baby gate. We've not had any problems with this during the night, we're still settling at alarm to get up as he's only 12 weeks. During the day is where we're having problems. Stuart was off for 2 weeks, but is back at work 8am till 16.40pm, I was off for the first fortnight too, but am now having to work 3 nights a week, which I wasn't when we got him, but it's a staffing issue, and my contract requires it. I was only doing 6 hour days, two of which were at the weekend, so 3 days a week my father in law was going to be coming over for a couple of hours when I was early shift. The two "sleep" day mornings are okay, and he only cries if he's had an accident in the kitchen, but is it fair on him? Stuart gets up a 6am, gives feeds and cuddles, plays with Jake, leaves at 7.40am. I get in at 8am, more cuddles and a bit of play and/or training, outside to toilet, and back into the kitchen with Misty and his toys for 8.30am. I sleep until 12.00, during this time he's normally quiet and seems settled. I normally have a pee to clean up (we tried using pads, but they are too inviting and get ripped up), he gets him lunch, more playing, cuddles, a little training, out for toilet, and back into the kitchen for 1.30pm. First problem - He doesn't settle very well after lunch, I'll maybe get an hour to an hour and a half before he's toileted in the kitchen, and shouts the house down to says he's done it. If I ignore him, he just doesn't stop, and I don't feel happy letting him get upset. And then I don't get to go back to sleep because he's too much energy. I've been on nights for 2 weeks now, and unfortunately it's not enough sleep. This just wasn't the plan, I was supposed to be day shift, and had the plans in place, now I'm not sure what I'm doing. I've spoken to the manager, but I'm looking at at least another 2 months of nights, as they cannot get care staff recruited for nights, maybe even more as I'm contracted for full availability. I've been thinking of day care, but that's an expense we never planned for, and I'm not even sure how much choice we have being a rural town. I even tried him on the bed with me in the afternoon, if he's tired he's fine for another hour, but if he's too jazzed up, he just jumps off the bed and off he goes. Jumping off the bad at 12 weeks, yikes, not something he should be doing, and he can't be unsupervised so..... I'd be quite happy to have him sleep with me during the day if he would stay put, but it's too big an ask for him I know. Second problem - When I take Misty out for a walk, he gets very upset, and howls and barks the house down. By having him sleep with her, I think he's become overly attached to her. We're working on him being in the kitchen on his own at times during the day when we're about, with a treat ball, or kong, but are in the early stages, he's quiet as long as the treat is there, but starts crying as soon as it's gone. I put one of these in when I take Misty out but he's howling by the time we get back about 20 minutes later. He doesn't get out when he's crying we're waiting for the breath of silence before going to him, but he hears us coming in the gate and up the path after our walk and stops crying. I've recorded this happening. Do I go straight in even though he's cried until he's heard me coming? I've not been able to get to the stage of freezing his kongs to make them last longer, he doesn't seem interested in them frozen, I think it's too hard for his to try and figure out? I'm using a little melted cheese, with treats or biscuits stuck inside, or scraping a little peanut butter inside. The problem is these don't last the length of our walk. Tips on kong fillings to last, or extra smelly frozen one that would encourage him to try and spend the time on it. I want to give Jake the best life, and do what's right for him, but is how I'm handling my 2 "sleep" days okay for him? If it's the weekend I'm on nights, Stuart is here all day for him but the other times it's as above. I hope were on the right track with starting to have him on his own without Misty, nut any advice or thoughts on all this are welcome. Oh, and they cannot be in the same room with high value chews or Kongs, as Misty is guarding her's against Jake, so leaving something while I'm sleeping is out. Sorry for the wall of text.
Yes - I would have him alone without Misty, mine can't be left together with Kongs either - one or the other pinches them both! Soaked kibble, stuffed in the Kong then frozen. Two of those should last about half an hour. I leave mine with a tripe stick too - they rush to their beds for that! Or how about a little doggy day care on your sleep days, that would work too
Paula: So sorry to hear the issues you are facing. I am no expert , If I were you, I would seperate the problems and work on each rather than finding a solution for all. First thing , that would concern me is toilet training During the day. If he is lasting 1 and half hours before he soills during lunch time, sounds like good enough time for 12 week puppy. Since you need to sleep more than that time, you will need a dog walker/ friend/family to deal with afternoon potty trips. Even morning, expecting him to last from 8-12 might not be realistic and you are cleaning up after you wake up, as they say less accidents , faster potty training so its an issue too getting attached to older dog, I do remember reading Pippa using her older digs to keep Rachael company at night which solved her howling at night problem but I think she kept them apart during the say so pup would bond with mum more . I did not pay lots of attention to that part since I only have one dog but might be a good read for you. Good luck and keep us posted
Could you ask your father in law to come in around 10.30/11am when you work nights to let Jake and Misty out for a wee and maybe take them for a short walk / do some training? The other option is to look at daycare just for the days that you work nights, especially as it's hopefully a short term solution. Is Jake going out for walks yet? Does he go alone or does Misty go as well? Might be good to walk him alone initially to help with the separation and will make him more independent. As for kongs.......tuna (including the liquid) mixed with a little bit of natural yoghurt. One tin of tuna (70g) usually does about 3 small kongs for us. I add a bit of water too to make it go further, but with the smell of fish, Harley doesn't care
Boogie I tried the soaked kibble, but he wasn't really excited by it and gave up after a few minutes, should I play with him and it to encourage some interest in it? Not sure if it was too difficult for him, or too boring . As for separating them, will it still be okay for them to sleep together over night, and just be separate when I'm sleeping and training the behaviour? Rocky-mum Don't worry I know they are separate issues I've been thinking about it, and your right, I've been expecting too much from him. I think because he's now lasting 5 hours and 15 minutes at night, I'm looking for the same during the day, which just isn't fair. I'll speak to the FIL and ask him to pop in at 10:30am, and then again at 3pm for a short term fix. Naya He's set to get out from Saturday, he'll be walking on his own for the majority, with a few walks together a week, but only when OH is around too, as I want to concentrate on training loose lead walking. The tuna sounds like a good idea, something nice and smelly to get his interest. It could go in with his kibble too. Is tuna okay at 12 weeks? We've only used small bits of peanut butter, cheese, carrots and green beans as treats so far. I'll check out day care more, I could only find two of them, so I'll need to see if there's space, and what they are like etc. I'm not on a set pattern, so hopefully they can accommodate that if I find a suitable one. Thanks for your answers
I think with kongs the trick is to work up to boring and frozen. You start with super tasty and not frozen, and gradually make it harder. Charlie started off with kongs stuffed with lightly grilled, line caught sardines, bought fresh that day from the harbour side, on a bed of crushed sea biscuit with kibble jus. Now, he gets his standard food, bought in wet form, and he's just as happy. I used to soak kibble and freeze it. But then, I found his frozen kongs were lasting no time at all! I couldn't understand it! Until, one evening when he had a frozen kong in the front room I observed his new technique. He would lick and lick the top of the kong until the ice reduced, then, he would CRUSH the narrow end of the kong in his jaws, shuffling the pressure along the kong and...POW! He popped the whole block of frozen kibble out in one. Then crunched it up in a microsecond. I now buy MASSIVE black extreme kongs and fill them with wet dog food that sort of sticks in the narrower end. It takes him much longer to get out and he will bring his kong to me when I get home so I can poke out the last bit in the bottom for him. Once I've done that, he says hello to me. Bit addicted to his kongs, is Charlie....
JulieT Charlie's Kongs sounded very a la carte He's such a smart cookie to figure out how to eject the frozen block! I never thought about wet food, we've only gave him wet when we wormed him, but we'll give that a try too. Any idea if it's okay to freeze wet food?
I have frozen wet food without any problems, it's always seemed fine. Not that I've frozen them since....the block of frozen kibble only narrowly missed the telly!
Oh yes - it's the food bit that's the problem. If you want to leave him with Kongs he'll need to be on his own. I do think, that - once alone - he will have a go at the kibble soaked and frozen Kongs. I used to leave mine with two Kongs and a tripe stick - the tripe stick got her over the 'leaving' moment and got her looking forward to being left. She got it just before I walked out of the door, no sooner.
Poor old you, you must be knackered. Lack of sleep is pretty normal for the owners of new pups, butyou seem to be having a double dose. Vigilance is definitely the way to toilet train. Frequent trips to the garden, watch them like a hawk and scoop and run as soon as you see them begin to squat. Not so easy when your eyes keep slamming shut through lack of sleep. If preparing frozen kongs you need to let it soak for a good while until the kibble has softened and increased in size. I then ram it in to make it as dense as possible, this means it takes a long time to consume. Try some toys like treat balls and Buster cubes. This will give his furry little brain something to work on and tire him out. ll forms of training even if it is a simple sit are brain work for dogs and nothing tires them out quicker which makes for a quiet life.
Haha, thanks for making me burst out laughing and nearly spit my drink across the room! I thought Ella was smart when she realised that picking up the Kong and repeatedly throwing it at the floor would make the filling come out quicker but Charlie has clearly taken it to another level!
Found a local doggy day care, she's just opening new premises, and hoping to get the keys this week. Hopefully it will be somewhere I'm happy with, I'm working tonight and tomorrow night, and then off for 12 nights as I'm on holiday again, so hoping to have him in on the 16th of December. She has good reviews, and we'll pop in and check the place out before letting him go. I'm really hoping the place is okay, I just sat today and cried. It's not because of Jake, it's just because I'm so tired, which isn't his fault in any way, shape or form. I called my manager again today, and stressed that nights were not working and could I get back onto days, she laughed and said "yes, sometime in the new year". Apparently she's only been able to recruit for day shift, not nights. I'm really pissed off, excuse my french, to begin with she said it would be 4 weeks, then 2 months, and now no set date. I've just sat and put my request to go back onto days in writing, I've dated it and reiterated that she initially said 4 weeks, which is next week! Today I came home, gave cuddles, let him out and went to bed with not excitement, he slept upstairs on the bed with Misty and I until 10:34am, alerted me he needed out, and then we went back to bed until 1pm. After that I tried a pigs ear, but it only lasted 40 minutes, so that was me for the day. I've been shopping and bought the Kongs Quests, both the bone and the starpod, those along with 3 normal kongs are now in the freezer. Mollly I think you misread my post, I'm not struggling with his toilet training, its that the poor boy is having no choice but to have the occasional accident while I'm trying to sleep
Hi Paula, my OH sometimes works nights too and his are usually seven days straight. I will have to work at some point during this time so he gets stuck with the same sleep/puppy issue as you. When he comes home and has to sleep, he pops Ella in the laundry (we have a baby gate across the entrance and it is a safe place - it has been our "puppy pen" from day one) with a Kong and some toys. He also leaves the back door open a little bit (we've worked out a way to hold it open just a little bit so it can't close but won't swing all of the way open either) so that she can go outside when she needs to. Be warned, this did lead to a minor toilet training setback which you may have read in one of my other posts but we fixed it pretty quickly and at least it has allowed my OH to get sleep when he needed to. Alternatively, is there a safe, weather proof area of your backyard or do you have a kennel? Would it be possible to leave the dogs outside while you sleep?
Oh god, wouldn't dare leave the back door open where we are. We have a dodgy neighbour 3 doors down, who has unsavoury visitors. Just need to cross our fingers the day care is satisfactory. Then with my 12 days off we'll work on him being alone, and get outside to start small walks.
Really do empathise on the lack of sleep . I was prepared but it still hit me like a freight train. On that front , it will pass grit teeth and soldier on! Hope the doggy daycare is good and will work out as seems like the best answer for you and Jake just now. Care work is tough enough without broken to zero rest and sleep. I had hooves to stuff when Finn was little. he even used them as chews which was great. Kongs have been the God of all feeding toys .. nothing but Kong Extremes for these wee chew monsters lol . I Raw feed my Dogs so they're food is all nom nom high value stuff although at 6 months he'll look at the frozen one now with that expression of seriously , I'll need to put effort in here .. If you can get hold of moo hooves then they would be something different and special which if he really enjoys then you can keep them only for times he has to stay on his own . Say the first time take Misty out for 10 minutes so he's still chomping away when you get back . Hopefully you can find something yummy to stuff in the kongs .. stuff he never gets at any other time. Best of luck . Our pupsters are hard work at times but when you watch tem play and learn they're just a whole bundle of the bestest
