Ugh. Vets are really not the best source of nutritional information - especially if he/she is the one selling you the food. Starting to feed your pup a worse quality food than what he's on now sounds like madness to me. Here's the ingredients of Hills W/D - pretty much low quality filler, more filler, nasty chicken by product, cra* fats and added vitamins and added "flavour" and colour. Oh, and my favourite: "powdered cellulose" which is (to quote the wall street journal) minuscule pieces of ground up wood pulp. And THAT is the third listed ingredient. So essentially this food is wheat, corn and wood. Horrible, horrible, horrible. Whole Grain Wheat, Whole Grain Corn, Powdered Cellulose, Chicken Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Whole Grain Sorghum, Soybean Mill Run, Chicken Liver Flavor, Pork Fat, Soybean Oil, Pork Liver Flavor, Lactic Acid, Caramel color, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, L-Lysine, vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (source of Vitamin C), Niacin Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, Biotin, Folic Acid, Vitamin D3 Supplement), Iodized Salt, minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), Taurine, L-Carnitine, Calcium Sulfate, DL-Methionine, L-Threonine, L-Tryptophan, Mixed Tocopherols for freshness, Natural Flavors, Beta-Carotene I think I've already told this story on the Forum, but I'll repeat it here because it really brought home to me how important diet is. My diabetic foster dog was with me for a month while her regular foster mama went on holiday. She'd been getting 2x a day shots for about a year at that point. Like many people in our rescue group, this pup's foster mama used what food was donated. Sometimes it was good, sometimes not so good, but all kibble. When she dropped the pup off, I asked her regular foster mama if she needed special food and she said, "Oh just feed her what you feed Brogan". So I did. She got fresh chicken, veggies, fruit, eggs and fish. Just like Brogan. And she got long walks and trips to the beach, just like Brogan. Within a couple weeks that little thing was looking like a star - she had so much more energy and acted like a younger dog (she was about 8 at the time). I was so proud of her. One night, though, I wake up at about 1am with her panting like a maniac on the bed next to me. Glazed eyes, looked like she had had a stroke. I rushed her to the emergency vet. Turns out she was having bad issues because I was religiously giving her the prescribed insulin but she didn't need nearly as much any more as she'd gotten healthier. I felt horrible - I nearly killed her by making her healthier! She ended up fine, but it was really, really scary. But it was also a good lesson to me just how much food can do for a dog (or for any living thing, I guess) and re-inforced to me that I wanted to keep feeding fresh instead of kibble. Also just wanted to add that it becomes just a habit to do the injections every 12 hours and have food always available. I had both pre-loaded syringes and doggie snacks stashed everywhere (car, my bag, house of course). The pup was always happy to get that shot because she was a total food hound and wanted her special treat (usually liver or chicken) that came with it. It didn't seem to hurt her at all. The only thing I wish I would have done was invest in a proper sharps disposal container as I ended up with used needles everywhere, especially in the car. They weren't littered around where someone could get jabbed - I tossed them into the armrest console - but I was always worried what someone would think if they opened it up and saw dozens of used needles sitting there. "My dog did it" just doesn't sound so convincing!
its me joe t and teddybear--- i got the insulin-but -hes not eating -so i got--boston turkey--chicken breast form there--bought chop meat -he loves hamburger--cube steak--he loves that--liverworst and turkey breast-boars head-he loves that-- i have to get him to eat----to give him his first shot--- his doc says to fill to number -10--but-- how much do i have to have him eat to do this------ im very afarid--should i only give him 5 on the needle--regardless of what he eats and it isnt gonna be much-- i need help guys----hes had no medication for this as of yet--and i read about the possible blindness that could happen-- what should i do-----im gonna start to cook the hamburger and cube steak---so the house smells like great food----and he will want some----but the safe amount---
I'm really worried about your last message - it sounds like you've not gotten clear instructions from your vet on dosage and how to administer it or an explanation for why he's not eating. If he's really doing poorly, shouldn't he be stabilised first at the vet hospital before starting on the insulin at home? Could you take him back to the vet or perhaps to a different vet who can give you a second opinion, patiently explain (and write down) the home care you'll need to give and make sure Teddy Bear is ok to go home?
Emily---he told me to do this----start teddy on i geuss its called 10 cc of this stuff--only--- today i told im picking it up today and he was frantic that i didnt give it to him yesterday- then i said hes not eating--he said--give him what he loves-get food in him and give him the shot--tonight-sun am-sun pm and he wants to see him monday-- i just fed teddy he ate aprox 1/2 of a can of wet food-but it was hamburger--steak-turkey--most hes eaten in 3 days------the timer is on---should i give 10--or a little bit lower
You really need to be asking these questions to the vet. Can you call them? Please make are you are clear on what you are supposed to be doing with the insulin and the food. It will be very dangerous for your dog if you don't understand what to do. We can give advice and support here, but we are not trained vets and we cannot give specific instructions on medication to give your dog that a vet has prescribed for him.
Do keep talking to your vet to sort out Teddy's food intake and insulin dose so that he can be stabilized as soon as possible. It's annoying how these problems often happen just when it's the weekend and it's difficult to talk to the vet. Try to use the beginning of this week to get your vet to help you with the medication.
10 is a pretty low dose for a 120 lb dog. Ginger was 80 lbs and IIRC she got 18 2x per day. The vet will always want to start low and work up to the proper dose, since too much insulin is worse than not enough. Which kind of insulin probably also influences the dose, but it has been 12 years since we had to deal with this.
Man, I'm just hoping for a happy ending here. Hope bear gets well. You are a good lab dad, Joe... We can feel the love you have for him.
thanks guys for all the help. Teddybear is still on 10 -2 times a day. i bought the alphatrack 2 starter kit for home testing and from wonder labs--vit-B12 1000mg with intrinsic factor-etc-- thats for his hind legs, hopefully it will help. also i want to get OCU-GLO RX--thats for his eyes--im gonna ask vet 1st-- vet said the b-12 is good- he eats at 8am-8pm--shot 1 hr later this afternoon ill be testing his blood for the 1st time- once the vet gets a few readings-i guess he will know how much insulin he really needs- he is never left alone now-- what i cant possibly comprehend is why this happened to my boy. teddy is all good and loving. i only gave him the best food possible--5 star only-- we treat him as a king of kings--in all ways--- and out of know where--he gets 1 of the worst if not the worst thing possible. joan is in a constant state of depression now--i have to watch her closley. me----all i think about is TeddyBear--cry in the car---i cant let joan see this-- i just tell joan---ok-hes stabilized and walking a little better-eating-- and when the doctor finds the right dose---he be good----thats what i have to say- AGAIN--THANKS PEOPLE or all your advise etc-etc-etc-----joe t
There is nothing you have done or not done to cause Teddy to develop diabetes. He is obviously a much loved and well cared for dog. Your love for him is obvious. You know Teddy well enough that when his behaviour changed you noticed and took him straight to the vet. And you are right-when the vet finds the correct insulin dosage both you and Teddy will settle into a new routine and things will get better. Please don't blame yourself.
It's just one of those things that can happen for no reason other than a change in his body chemistry. I'm glad you are coping so far and hope the vet soon works out the best dose for Teddy.
Not your fault at all. It is something in his genes he will have inherited. You are doing good. Check the bloods and keep in touch with your vet. Are you sure insulin is for giving AFTER meals? I just say this because people with diabetes usually have their insulin shots before they eat, not after. I have no experience in dogs though. If this is what your vet told you then it will be right. jac
jac--------its different with dogs---- dr bistry--hes also the medical director of the place told me, give teddy his food--and he must eat------then in 1 hour give him the shot-- so i feed him--set timer on microwave 1 hr--when it goes off---i give it to him--- TeddyBear still isnt wise to the routine yet and thats good---hes real smart- after the shot--i gibe him a piece of chicken breast---he loves it--
I used to spend time on a diabetic dog mail list, and there was no rhyme or reason why some dogs became diabetic. With Ginger, it just came on over about a week, with no warning, or known cause. Once we got her on the right dosage, she was a pretty normal Lab, living a normal life except for the 2x daily shots. She still went hiking and swimming, just like before, only we had to keep an eye on her levels when she got more exercise.
