Alpha Dog - Facts about dominance and pack leaders

Discussion in 'Labrador Training' started by lucy@labforumHQ, Mar 23, 2017.

  1. lucy@labforumHQ

    lucy@labforumHQ Administrator Forum Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2013
    Messages:
    960
    Are you worried about dog dominance? Have you been told that it's important to be the alpha dog?

    In the latest article from The Labrador Site, Pippa takes a look at what it means to be a pack leader - and whether it's actually relevant to today's dog owners.

    Alpha Dog - The Important Of Pack Leadership
     
    SwampDonkey and drjs@5 like this.
  2. Harley Quinn

    Harley Quinn Registered Users

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2017
    Messages:
    1,173
    I will completely and honestly admit that I was one of the people that watched the TV shows and thought...well, I suppose that sounds about right. But exactly for that reason I have resisted us getting a dog for almost a decade - because I knew that I didn't want to, nor did I think I was capable of dominating a dog. Also when watching the TV programmes you see the extreme cases but when you think about owning a dog you can't draw a logical line from what is done on the programmes to how to train your dog. There is no sequence to it for me. So it left me even more bewildered and convinced that I am just a cat person.

    And then, of course getting Harley, who as a pup and even more as she is growing and bonding with us, in no way wants to be the boss of anything or anyone. She just wants a family.
     
  3. Beanwood

    Beanwood Registered Users

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,303
    @Harley Quinn yup with you there! My three dogs just want to be part of the family, they don't want to be "pack leaders", too much like hard work! They have very different personalities, and yes one may be having a bad day and rub another up the wrong way...but hey! That's just life :) I can be really bad tempered in the morning...but it is laughable to think I am just being dominant. Humans and dogs just keep out of my way until I have had a coffee. :)

    Thought this artilce was interesting..:)

    http://lifeasahuman.com/2011/pets/blunt-force-trauma-canine-reality
     
  4. selina27

    selina27 Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2016
    Messages:
    3,202
    Location:
    Herefordshire UK
    Yes @Beanwood very interesting article. All this "no need to dominate" stuff is music to my ears - I'm far too lazy to bother to dominate anything! Joking aside the more I think about it, why would I want to? I chose to bring her into my life so I owe it to her to be as happy as possible, bad days permitting. She's really my mate and I can't understand why society would be reluctant to take on positive re-enforcement training, it's a joy. My only regret is I could have done a better job with Cassie if my understanding had been better in the beginning......maybe, just maybe, I need another one, to do it all again?!!!
     
    SwampDonkey and Beanwood like this.
  5. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2014
    Messages:
    15,785
    Location:
    Andorra and Spain
    Definitely. :nod:
    It's a joy training Luna, with the extra experience I now have. The next one will be even better ;)
     
    drjs@5, selina27 and SwampDonkey like this.
  6. Emily_BabbelHund

    Emily_BabbelHund Longest on the Forum without an actual dog

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2016
    Messages:
    3,959
    Location:
    Regensburg, Germany (Bavaria)
    While I always used positive training methods, I also thought to be a good trainer I needed to buy into the dominant/submissive thing. As I am perhaps the least dominant person on the planet, this was not a comfortable role for me and it felt like play acting. Whether humans or dogs, I simply don't like bossing people around and would rather just work as a member of a team without all the drama. That's why I was really quite glad to have my eyes opened on this forum that the whole dominance/submission thing is not only just a theory (vs. scientific fact), but it is an outdated theory.

    I'm very excited about training my next dog with this "You must be the boss" thing lifted off my shoulders. :)

    On a different track, and something I've mentioned before here, is that I have several friends who are huge fans of the dominance/submission theory and its well-known advocate. They are never anything but kind to their dogs, but what I've observed is that they don't train them. If they have an undesirable behaviour, they just live with it and explain it as "oh, he's just a dominant dog - that's what they do".

    They were (and still are) convinced that Brogan was perfect, simply because they first met him with eight years of training under his belt. They didn't see the years of hard work, mistakes, tears and triumphs, just the end result. Nothing I can say, after five years of shared dog walks, can convince them that their dogs too could come when called, not chase other dogs or runners, not snap over food, etc., if they just worked with them.

    Beyond the punitive aspect of the d/s theory, I think that is the greatest trap: people think, "Well, I stared at my dog, said 'Eaah!' when he was naughty and put him in an alpha roll but he's still not trained - guess it's hopeless."
     
    snowbunny likes this.
  7. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2014
    Messages:
    15,785
    Location:
    Andorra and Spain
    *feels every scientist in the room shudder* :cwl:
     
    Emily_BabbelHund likes this.
  8. Emily_BabbelHund

    Emily_BabbelHund Longest on the Forum without an actual dog

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2016
    Messages:
    3,959
    Location:
    Regensburg, Germany (Bavaria)
    Oh, and pretty ironic...look what came up in my push ads when I was reading Pippa's article. If it's too small to see, it includes ads for shock and prong collars. Sigh.

    Screenshot 2017-03-24 13.28.35.png
     
  9. Emily_BabbelHund

    Emily_BabbelHund Longest on the Forum without an actual dog

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2016
    Messages:
    3,959
    Location:
    Regensburg, Germany (Bavaria)
    Hey, this is why I'm in marketing and can't add past ten unless I'm wearing sandals. I leave all that science stuff to you scientific types. :D
     
    snowbunny likes this.
  10. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2014
    Messages:
    15,785
    Location:
    Andorra and Spain
    I have the TV on in the background when I work. With the snow, the satellite signal gets a bit rubbish, so I end up on those channels at the end of the list, which, somehow, manage to keep broadcasting their 20-year-old episodes of Robot Wars and Ninja Warrior whatever the weather.
    He-who-shall-remain-nameless is often on. It makes me physically cringe just to sit through the intro. I can't reach that remote fast enough.

    Oh dear :(
     
  11. Beanwood

    Beanwood Registered Users

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,303
    :eek::eek::D
     
  12. SwampDonkey

    SwampDonkey Registered Users

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2015
    Messages:
    8,126
    Location:
    leicestershire uk
    I make myself watch as much as I can of he who can't be spoken of to remind me to treat my dogs how they deserve to be treated. not that I really need to

    For me it's me and my doggies against the world.

    All for one and one for all
     
    edzbird and Emily_BabbelHund like this.
  13. selina27

    selina27 Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2016
    Messages:
    3,202
    Location:
    Herefordshire UK
    I can so relate to this - I don't think I realised quite how much this is true until I got Cassie though, the world of dogs and training had moved on so much since our last family/ farm dog 15 or so years ago.
     
    SwampDonkey and Emily_BabbelHund like this.
  14. selina27

    selina27 Registered Users

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2016
    Messages:
    3,202
    Location:
    Herefordshire UK
    oh yes, indeed! Comes across in your posts -- in the best possible way !!
     
    Beanwood and SwampDonkey like this.
  15. SwampDonkey

    SwampDonkey Registered Users

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2015
    Messages:
    8,126
    Location:
    leicestershire uk
    I think most of us who live with dogs didn't buy into the whole Dom thing. We just kept it quiet what we really got up to at home. I been Lucky enough to see the downfall of it and a welcome better way of doing things. Also because my dogs seem happier and more well adjusted than those selling me the dom stuff dogs i just smile now and say stuffs moved on a great deal why don't you give it a go.
     
    selina27 and Beanwood like this.

Share This Page