Hello everyone Our gorgeous Ruby is now 10 weeks old, and she;s settling in really well to our home. Loves her crate, pretty much house trained, and great at basic sitting and recall (she's very food motivated! LOL). She's starting to get a bit more confident, and boisterous, as expected! And I would like to introduce the lead to her in order to have a bit of control without always resorting to popping her in her crate. This is for when my children (3 and 1) are playing a bit excitedly in the garden, and hyping her up indadvertedly... also when my two cats, who are now bored of sulking about the puppy arriving, and actually want to just come into the house, eat, sleep, and not be barked (!!!) or chased Also because next week she'll be cleared to go out and about having had her vaccinations, so it would be nice to be able to take her into town/pets at home etc. I think I've got myself into a bit of a psychological state over the lead as my previous 2 dogs have been awful at pulling, and I'm so keen to not have a puller!!! If anyone has ANY tips, for introducing this successfully without making a complete mess of things, I'd be really grateful!
Re: Introducing the lead Hello birth-date twin! I'll be very interested in any comments too! Very exciting going out into the outside world!
Re: Introducing the lead First of all teach her to walk by your heel OFF lead! I was told to take ten small pieces of kibble in my right hand and when the puppy was by my side, to put one piece of that kibble in my left hand and reward him. Then when the pup takes two steps by your side, reward, then three steps etc. So when he had the lead on he already knew where I wanted him to be. We might have had some lead pulling but not too much. If you start at a very early age it makes it all so much easier.
Re: Introducing the lead Basically you need to start as you mean to go on - if you don't want your pup to pull you as an adult then you must not allow any pulling at all right from the very beginning. It can be very tiresome and feel like hard work but in a couple of months it will have paid off big time and you'll have a dog that walks nicely by your side. Whether you choose the stop when there's tension on the lead method, or turn around and walk the other way when pulling, or just sheer bribery! (I used a combination of all) is up to you but you have to stick to your guns and be consistent. And make sure that anyone else who will be taking her out follows the exact same program you do.
Re: Introducing the lead Thanks Stacia and Penny+Me - I'll just go for it then 8) She's already really good at walking to heel if she thinks there's a chance of kibble/cheese etc.! I guess short periods of training as with everything else, and make it fun. Will let you know how we get on. Good luck too Debs!
Re: Introducing the lead It does seem a bit contradictory this dog training sometimes, doesn't it! How do you take your young pup out and about for socialising - the lead being essential to prevent them scampering off? But you haven't got the heel while on the lead sorted out . It doesn't make sense - by the time we've got the heel work sorted out, the socialising period has gone. Dilemma! The answer is the two things are separate, personally I don't use the lead as method of restraint in the house or garden better to just remove the dog or the cats! We have the same issue with our two cats, just let them be, they'll sort it out between themselves, after a week or so they'll have reached an understanding. Same with the children, they have to learn not to get the pup over excited (sorry). Then going out - keep up your heel work like you're doing, you will have made huge progress by the time your pup has had his vaccinations. Nothing wrong with picking him up still at this early stage of being in town and just keep the lead walking to a minimum. Trying to avoid opportunities to pull - so easy to say but really, if you stick to your heel work plan, don't teach him that the lead is a restraining device - all will be fine.
Re: Introducing the lead This is the clincher..... [quote author=Penny+Me link=topic=6020.msg78053#msg78053 date=1400273849] And make sure that anyone else who will be taking her out follows the exact same program you do. [/quote] I've had a shocker pulling journey ??? I think I could cover every aspect of retraining loose lead walking except the above!i just couldn't say to my Husband that he couldn't walk Dexter so I've had to accept my task is harder : Dexter still needs reminding and has flashpoints .hes my first dog and as much as I thought I was prepared for him we have totally learned as we have gone along ,we still are ;D at 20 months ;D. ;D There are some really great articles on the main site to use as well as all the advice passed on here,good luck,Ruby sounds like a great pup,let us know how you get on x
Re: Introducing the lead Yep, the dreaded 'consistency' - Dexter has hit the nail on the head. The most difficult aspect of training if your dog is living inside and is primarily a pet. Crack that and you've crossed the biggest hurdle!!
Re: Introducing the lead Argh! Yes it's very confusing, and I appreciate all the input and understanding! Off to read some of the articles on the site She did quite well with a couple of short bursts on the lead walking up and down the garden path with some treats yesterday and today, but I'm worried about the puppy socialisation classes where she'll be on the lead for at least half an hour! oh well... we'll just see how we go. I agree about the children learning not to wind her up - they do their best for 3 and 1 ;-) much of the time they are just playing doing their own thing. And yes, the cats are standing their ground more so I think we'll get there! On a seperate note, good grief those teeth are sharp - she's just lacerated my nose! Completely my fault thinking I could give her a kiss and bad timing lol :
Re: Introducing the lead I shouldn't laugh....but sorry, couldn't help myself I do hope you and your nose are okay
Re: Introducing the lead [quote author=Ems76 link=topic=6020.msg78367#msg78367 date=1400338854] She did quite well with a couple of short bursts on the lead walking up and down the garden path with some treats yesterday and today, but I'm worried about the puppy socialisation classes where she'll be on the lead for at least half an hour! oh well... we'll just see how we go. [/quote] You do right to take it slow, a bit of time now might pay off for a decade or more. In terms of puppy/socialisation classes, I wish I had spent a bit more time getting my boy used to be restrained on a harness before I started those. He doesn't like harnesses now, and I have a nagging feeling puppy class was where it went wrong. You will need to be able to have her on a lead, a harness is a good idea, but maybe get her used to the feeling of not being able to go where she wants (rather than walking) before you go?
Re: Introducing the lead [quote author=drjs@5 link=topic=6020.msg78460#msg78460 date=1400351735] I shouldn't laugh....but sorry, couldn't help myself I do hope you and your nose are okay [/quote] It's still sore!!! hehe - it is funny, I don't mind you laughing! ;D
Re: Introducing the lead [quote author=JulieT link=topic=6020.msg78470#msg78470 date=1400352853] [quote author=Ems76 link=topic=6020.msg78367#msg78367 date=1400338854] She did quite well with a couple of short bursts on the lead walking up and down the garden path with some treats yesterday and today, but I'm worried about the puppy socialisation classes where she'll be on the lead for at least half an hour! oh well... we'll just see how we go. [/quote] You do right to take it slow, a bit of time now might pay off for a decade or more. In terms of puppy/socialisation classes, I wish I had spent a bit more time getting my boy used to be restrained on a harness before I started those. He doesn't like harnesses now, and I have a nagging feeling puppy class was where it went wrong. You will need to be able to have her on a lead, a harness is a good idea, but maybe get her used to the feeling of not being able to go where she wants (rather than walking) before you go? [/quote] Took her to our local garden centre for lunch, as a bit of a socialisation for her. She was an angel - a bit all over theplace with the lead, but very upbeat and confident, bless her. She got lots of fuss from shoppers ;D Then she amazed me while we sat to eat as she pretty much just sat! I made sure the lead was loose when she was sitting, and she made no fuss whatsoever. Clever girl. I am preparing for problems at puppy training though as she's going to hate being restrained with other pups to meet! Will update!
Re: Introducing the lead How did you get on at puppy class?Im sure she was excited to be around other dogs,it's a massive challenge for them to be in a room with other dogs on the lead so if she was massively interested in her classmates ......everything would have gone totally as expected!hope you enjoyed yourselves though x
Re: Introducing the lead [quote author=Dexter link=topic=6020.msg82007#msg82007 date=1401105856] How did you get on at puppy class?Im sure she was excited to be around other dogs,it's a massive challenge for them to be in a room with other dogs on the lead so if she was massively interested in her classmates ......everything would have gone totally as expected!hope you enjoyed yourselves though x [/quote] She was brilliant, bless her! I think we are really lucky that she's pretty good so far - we'd like to think it's us putting in work doing heel work in the garden before introducing the lead, but in all honesty I think she's just a clever girl ;-) Luckily there was only one other puppy there, so it was practically one to one. I was not overly sure on some of her techniques and general 'show the dog you are the leader/boss' type attitude, but we'll see how we go. I am armed with plenty of Pippa's reading material and this forum for advice too! The main thing that concerned me was that she recommended jerking the lead if the pup pulls at all, which frankly scared poor Ruby. I raised it with her and she said that the dog doesn't associate you with the jerking/flicking of the lead, but they associate it with the lead itself - well either way it's a bad association! I have been using the tactic of just turning around and walking in a different direction, but I have found using lots of praise and treats has her doing it pretty much without pulling anyway, so hopefully we can just ignore this bit of advice and I won't be asked to do it in future classes.... any thoughts on this? Thanks, as ever! Emma & Ruby Chewsday x
Re: Introducing the lead [quote author=Ems76 link=topic=6020.msg82917#msg82917 date=1401308779] I was not overly sure on some of her techniques and general 'show the dog you are the leader/boss' type attitude, but we'll see how we go. The main thing that concerned me was that she recommended jerking the lead if the pup pulls at all, which frankly scared poor Ruby. I raised it with her and she said that the dog doesn't associate you with the jerking/flicking of the lead, but they associate it with the lead itself - well either way it's a bad association! I have been using the tactic of just turning around and walking in a different direction, but I have found using lots of praise and treats has her doing it pretty much without pulling anyway, so hopefully we can just ignore this bit of advice and I won't be asked to do it in future classes.... any thoughts on this? [/quote] Substitute 'show your dog you are the leader etc' for 'your dog should respect you' - and that may be all she actually means. Equally, it remains a fact that dogs are pack animals, substitute "live in social groups" for "pack" - that may help to separate the negative connotations of dominance. Not that much different to small children really. If positive reward operant conditioning is your method for not getting her to pull on the lead - nothing basically wrong with that, but then neither is a short sharp jerk (just enough to show her you're in control) your dog isn't going to be psychologically scarred for life by having a boundary enforced upon her. She may even be the better dog for learning that life isn't all about getting rewards and treats.
Re: Introducing the lead Hi Emma It can be difficult, in a class situation, to go a different way from the instructor. So it might be a good idea for you to have a good think about how you want to tackle this. In general terms, it isn’t a good idea to attend classes if you are not happy with the instructor’s training philosophy. You won’t be able to rehearse what you have been shown if it doesn’t sit well with you, and you won’t be getting the help and support you need from your instructor. You really need to be on the same page. Heelwork can be trained very successfully with positive reinforcement, or with corrections (lead jerks), or a combination of both. So this is not a question of which way is right, but more of a personal decision for you, as to how you want to train your dog. If you decide to go along with the use of lead jerks, it is important not to use too much force, and to make sure that the movement you make is a sideways one, rather than a backwards one. This unbalances the dog, minimizes the force you need and avoids putting pressure on the front of the dog’s throat. This is something best demonstrated than described. If you decide you want to stick with positive reinforcement and avoid punishment you would probably be happier in an APDT class. http://www.apdt.co.uk
Re: Introducing the lead I just had a quick look at the APTD link and was pleased to see the trainer I had watched is listed. Very reassuring.
Re: Introducing the lead Really pleased your girl did well! [quote author=Ems76 link=topic=6020.msg82917#msg82917 date=1401308779] The main thing that concerned me was that she recommended jerking the lead if the pup pulls at all, which frankly scared poor Ruby. [/quote] I very much dislike this, I'm not surprised you didn't like it either. I don't like seeing dogs jerked and pulled around, lots of dogs look just miserable when this happens, and I can't see that it's better - in terms of how your dog views you, the collar and lead, and training - than achieving the same outcome in a way that is pleasant and enjoyable for you and your dog. And she is still so young! Plenty of time to get it right in a more fun and gentle way.
