July/August challenge - working around food

Discussion in 'Forum Challenges' started by snowbunny, Jul 13, 2017.

  1. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    Absolutely! That's what it's all about :)
     
  2. charlie

    charlie Registered Users

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    Bless your boy xx :heart:
     
  3. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    OK, this is something to aim for! What do we reckon?

    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Beanwood

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    Haha! @snowbunny :)

    Well, here we go with Casper again. Taking @bbrowns advice, we move the bowl further away...and....

     
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  5. charlie

    charlie Registered Users

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    :D All that's left is to put the bowl on the placeboard! :D xx
     
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  6. Stacia

    Stacia Registered Users

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    He has it in his head that the correct thing to do, is eat the food, then go to place :D How about you standing between the bowl and place and then sending him ahead of you to place (bowl behind you), once you succeed with that, you could gradually make it into a triangle.
     
  7. Beanwood

    Beanwood Registered Users

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    I have tried that..but nope. You are right, Casper has a "pattern" now in his head. I think I need to bring OH @Bensons-dad dad to give a helping hand :)
     
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  8. edzbird

    edzbird Registered Users

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    You can actually see Casper play out the planned scene in the think-bubble over his head. The boy has style.
     
  9. Stacia

    Stacia Registered Users

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    How about putting a weeny treat on the place board and sending him for that, then reward for something bigger in the bowl? Eventually get rid of the teeny weeny treat.
     
  10. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    Hehe, good work, Casper!

    I actually think it's easier to have the bowl closer to you, so you can cover it with your foot if needs be. Or else, fake putting the food in a few time so he can't self reward. When I do this, I still release the dog to it, but run with them to collect their reward.

    I had a mixed bag with my lot this morning. I'll upload it once I've got it on my computer so you can see :D
     
  11. Joy

    Joy Registered Users

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    As Stacia says, I think Casper thinks he's doing what you want. I'd hold the bowl in my hand, send him to the board, then put the bowl down and send him to that. He's not giving off the body language of a dog who just can't resist grabbing the food -it looks much more as though he thinks it's part of the exercise.
     
  12. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    OK, here are our latest entries, warts and all! This is our first go since I did the last video, as we've bee working on other things, so no improvements t be seen from the end of the last one.

    First up, Squidge:



    My notes (sorry, rather dull reading, but just my brain dump:(
    Moving the bowl around and changing direction to allow for generalisation. Still only very short distances.
    Using the hand farthest from the bowl for the target to help her.
    When she gets it right, she gets extra treats from me.
    When increasing the distance between her and me, I move the bowl farther to the side.
    When I then moved the bowl back in closer, she self rewarded. I didn't punish (obviously), but she got no extra treat or celebration. It's interesting to look back at the video of her body language to see that this did affect her quite profoundly. I will have to be careful of this.
    I then switched to using a toy in the bowl, which has very high value to her.
    I shortened the distance, and pushed the bowl back, but she still attempted to self reward, so I hadn't reduced the criteria enough. Again, her body language was a bit subdued after not getting the reward.
    I moved the bowl farther back and she was successful, with a little hesitation, but grabbed her reward with gusto.
    I moved the bowl back closer again and waited for good focus before asking for the touch. She definitely had better understanding this time, and had confident body language.
    An increase in distance between her and me at this stage presented her with no difficulty ad even the extra confidence in her play was obvious.
    I then moved on to retrieving, with her reward coming from the bowl - to build up to retrieving when there's a hamburger by the dummy (maybe by the year 2030!) :)
    I start off with the bowl by my feet, then move it out so she has to run past it. At first I put it on the left, the change my mind to move it to the right, because I'm then between her and it, so it will be easier for her.
    At the moment, I'm not asking for any steadiness from her, wanting to build speed into her retrieving patterns, so that makes it easier for her to ignore the food, as she's chasing the dummy. On the return, though, she checked it out the first time. The second time, she had gained the confidence that she would get it after delivery, so she was happy to return straight to me.
     
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  13. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    Next up, Willow:



    My notes:
    She self rewarded on the first attempt, so I just calmly set her up again. She is experienced enough to realise that this means something has to change, so, even though on the second attempt, I faked the food in the bowl, she was one step ahead and had worked out the game. Doing it right means she gets what's in the bowl and extra treats. This is very important to the Duchess :)
    First retrieve past the bowl, I don't think she had clocked there was food in it, but after eating from it as her reward for the retrieve, she knew for the second go and went to it before collecting the dummy. Again, no celebration meant that, even though I faked the food on the next go, there was no hesitation.
    Next go with food in the bowl, she was flawless.
    I wouldn't normally direct to the dummy with my arm on a marked retrieve, but I wanted to be perfectly clear I was sending her to that, rather than the food bowl.
     
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  14. charlie

    charlie Registered Users

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    I'm enjoying all these videos as they are helping me with Hattie & Charlie's training, my hash of a video will be ready soon :eek: Can I ask why you fake the food as the dog could still go to an empty bowl which is still self rewarding? :confused: xx
     
  15. Joy

    Joy Registered Users

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    Well done! Luna, especially, is so good for a puppy. :doug:
     
  16. snowbunny

    snowbunny Registered Users

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    Finally, Shadow:



    My notes:

    Straight into the retrieve pattern with him, because he's less motivated by the food, so I skipped the refresher.
    I really need to do some work with this boy on how he holds the dummy. Every now and again, he starts holding the end like this.
    Second retrieve, he knew the bowl was there, as he kept looking at it when I was lining him up for the dummy. I should have moved closer to the bowl at this point, to make it easier for him (as it would mean me being more between him and the bowl).
    I faked the food on the next go. He went to check, so unlike his sister! But learnt there was nothing there. As he didn't manage to go past the bowl, I then faked the food again, and this time, although there was a little look on the outrun, he went past it, so he got to have his reward from the bowl, plus extras to really reinforce he'd done the right thing. Repeated this a couple of times to consolidate it before the jackpot of a ball.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2017
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  17. snowbunny

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    Yes, he goes to the empty bowl, but learns there's nothing there, so there's no point in doing it. You'll see that with Shadow above. The reward comes from doing what is asked and, because dogs like to be efficient, that step is superfluous.

    They soon learn that, when they are successful in the whole pattern, they get the reward they could have taken "for free", but also much more. It's simply a case of making sure that pattern doesn't get established in the wrong order (food before behaviour) until they have learnt that fact. :)

    I'm looking forward to seeing the dashing duo in full Technicolor! :D
     
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  18. Joy

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    I thought it was brilliant that Willow was able to sit and watch without trying to join in.
     
  19. charlie

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    Great, thanks Fiona for the explanation. I get it. :)

    I will have my little camera man to help out so at least the video quality should be good :) as for the training errr ……. yeah, don't get your hopes up :Dxx
     
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  20. snowbunny

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    She's a good girl :)
    Both W&S will do this happily. Luna is a work in progress, so she has her training sessions alone, and I do W&S together, unless, like this morning, I am specifically working on her staying settled while they do stuff. She's at the stage where she will stay on her bed (which I take out with us) while I am close by, trowing treats around, asking for behaviours from W&S etc, but if I move more than a couple of steps away, she can't manage. So I have a plan to get that better. Training never stops! :D
     
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