Hello and Merry Christmas , i haven't read the forum in awhile, in the meanwhile Sirius became 1 year old , he's very sociable with other people and all but there's still one thing in the way.... seems like i can't really get to stop the mouthing no matter what. I played with him a bit and after we were done i gave him some praise and a treat, he got very excited and started running bouncing everywhere till he started jumping on me while biting very hard catching my cloth as well, another example was the other day when he was very happy and he started again to jump and nip at my cloth. So if anyone could give me some tips on this i would appreciate that, bear in mind that i read some of the articles of this site but it doesn't really help me that much sadly...
I don't think I can offer much help but Ripple is now just 7 months and has started this again, he used to do it loads as a small puppy but now with him a lot bigger it is a real pain. All I can do is stand still with my arms folded and wait for him to stop, quite often it is when I am out with him on the lead and he usually gets himself tangled in the lead as well which makes him worse. He growls and jumps and grabs at my clothes (and any exposed bits of skin) which is quite frightening sometimes, he is completely unreachable at these times so I find there is no point in saying 'enough' which I was hoping to try and train. Although it's over in a few minutes it can feel like forever standing in the park whilst other people look on in horror. Usually at the end of this he sits calmly and then walks on as if it had never happened. It sounds as if Sirius is behaving very similarly, for me I have no idea what triggers it so therefore cannot prevent it. I believe Mollly has had a similar problem in the past so I guess it is not uncommon.
This kind of thing is about an over excited young dog that is reverting to silly puppy stuff. They grow out of it. Just gently discourage by withdrawing attention, make sure they find it as unrewarding as possible (so do nothing that might encourage them to think it's a fun game - standing stock still and being very, very boring is good). And it all goes away - eventually. It is about the dog getting over excited, or frustrated because an activity has stopped. So try to do what you can about those things. Easier said than done, I know, but just watch out for signs that your dog is getting too wound up by games etc and try to switch to an activity more likely to calm them down before things get out of hand. If possible, which it often isn't.
thanks to both.... julie i'll try to stay still longer but the problem is he pulls hard my cloth and bites like crazy. I really hope he'll grow out of it but he's already 1 year old that's the problem....
It's not a huge deal, although I do appreciate that it probably feels like one! If it's really too much for you, you can try having him on a harness and tie him to the nearest gate post and stand just out of reach until he calms down. I know this sounds extreme, but it isn't - I had different problems with my boy, but he got tied to an immovable object quite a lot when he was younger! Not for very long, as soon as he calmed down I returned to him and gave him loads of scrummy treats. You say in your original post that: You need to look at the 'played with him a bit' - most people can drive a young, excitable dog to really heady heights of excitement quite easily. Look at how you play with him, and try to use play as a reward for training and calm behaviour....
I tried standing still but really enjoy tugging with my clothes and bite quite hard, i don't think i have a place where i could attach him with the harness sadly
Boxing Day with Ripple was awful - he was hyper wound up, wouldn't be distracted enough to do any training, bit me, bit OH, ran riot with the kitchen mats in his mouth, wouldn't be dried when he came in from the garden. I was in tears by the end of the day. Today a totally different dog, did all his training - even some new things which he couldn't understand he concentrated until I managed to get my head round how to explain them to him (squeeze of Primula was very helpful). I did all this on my own, OH took him for a walk - Ripple was fine, got back home and I could see him just starting to go over the edge. Then OH started to get annoyed at him, not shouting just a cross tone of voice and that was it he was gone, total loony. Terrorised the cats, jumped all over the furniture, tore OH coat. He's calm again now but it is hard work keeping everything on an even keel and I guess the more upset we get the worse he behaves. On a day like yesterday I can really understand why dogs of this age get put up for adoption; at the moment I am feeling like rehoming OH D) as it seems his getting cross was the trigger for Ripple going over the top. You have all my sympathies Peter, I'm sure with the help of this forum (which has kept me sane) you will find a way through this.
Well the thing is that he's one year old now and i thought it would have been fine by now, but that's not the case i wanted to fix this problem first but it seems like it's kinda hard no idea how am i supposed to fix the others then sigh
I never had the biting thing with my dog - but he was (and still is) a dog that gets seriously over excited, and frustrated extremely easily. I've also trained with a few dogs who do the jumping up, nipping, tugging clothes when over excited or activity stops (frustration). These things can easily last until the dog is a year old or more. I know it's hard to believe but you just have to keep being calm, consistent, ignore and don't reward the behaviour, and it will go away. In the meantime, make sure your dog has plenty of constructive activities - training - and include lots and lots of impulse control exercises in that training. This helps, indirectly, and is the best thing you can do with a dog that struggles with over excitement and frustration.
The advice given above is really good. I can just add that I have experienced a similar thing over the last couple of days. I have two dogs from the same litter and a friend has another one from the same. A brief history: we brought Willow home at 8 weeks, then Shadow came to us at 14 weeks - at the same time, Annie went to live with my friends, who are just down the road. We went through the crocopup phase with Willow, but trained her bite inhibition, and she's absolutely perfect now. Shadow didn't have this phase with us, because he was that much older and had been taught by his mum, we assumed, but can nibble clothing when very excited. No big deal, it's kinda sweet and not determined. Annie, however, can be a complete terror. They are coming up 17 months now, so not babies anymore. On Christmas Day, I was cooking for a crowd up at this friend's house, and took the dogs. They stayed downstairs while everyone was upstairs eating, but when I went down to go to the loo, the dogs were super excited. This manifested itself as: Shadow giving a full body wag, Willow jumping up a bit to try and lick my nose and Annie clamping hold of my bare arm and not letting go. Having not had a dog that has done that, I was a bit confounded. She's not normally like that, but was completely over threshold. I turned my back, I crossed my arms and I tried to ignore her, but an adult Labrador (even an itty bitty one like her) is a powerful animal and I am a pixie that only weighs 51kg, so am easily pushed around. Knowing the theory of turning my back and becoming boring, that worked with Willow as a tiny pup, was not going to work with her. I tried to remove myself and go back upstairs, but she leaped up the stairs in front of me and continued to jump up, to the point it was dangerous. So, I gave up on going back upstairs for a while, and ended up locking myself in the loo!! I came out after a few seconds and, if she started again, I went back in. In the end, she was still completely over-excited, and, to be honest, she's not my dog to train, but I did manage to make it up the stairs unscathed in the end. The things I took away from this were: 1. Getting the training in early, where possible, is so important. 2. Determined adult Labs are big, strong and a lot more difficult to manage than pups. 3. When you have a dog that's so over-threshold, it's really more about management than training. 4. In order to train a different way, you need to keep your dog at a lower excitement level. I absolutely agree that training impulse control is very important. I'm a novice trainer, and I have two dogs of the same age which means that I'm nowhere near as far along as I'd have been just having one, but the most important things that have helped everyday living with them have been around impulse control. Preventing them pulling on the lead, stopping them running off towards other dogs or people unless I tell them to, only going for a ball/dummy when released etc. These are all great ways of teaching your dog that better rewards can come from controlling themselves than acting on their impulses immediately. It's still a work in progress and always will be, but training things like this do help to put the idea in the dog's brain that good things come to those who are calm and can wait.
Thanks to both and yes i can imagine what Annie became like that's exactly what i''ve been experiencing with Sirius so far but now he's 31kg and pulls like crazy if he gets an old of my cloth. Both your advices seems good but i'm not sure if i'm fun enough when i train with him he doesn't wave his tail but maybe that means nothing? Anyway thanks to all again i'll try to do some exercises like those you mentioned but which ones? If you can suggest some
Hi Peter, well, a dog should enjoy training, he should be super keen to train - it needs to be the most fun thing ever. But it takes a while to get there, I really struggled with my dog. He is the kind of dog that lives for FUN and is the master of creating his own. So it was a long old journey for him to think I was the most fun thing, for sure. There are loads of books on achieving this (it is a very common problem to have), and you have to be quite inventive if you don't have the kind of dog that will stay engaged and focussed on you just because you have some treats about your person. My dog is such a dog! Tell us about the kind of thing that you do with your dog now, and why you don't think your dog is having fun. Impluse control exercises are all about leaving things to get a reward. So, leaving food, leaving a toy, leaving play with another dog. You have to convince your dog that controlling himself and leaving the things he wants, or activities he wants to do, gets him a reward - a super treat, a great game of fetch, or tug, or catch, or chase - whatever he values. You start impulse control with basic 'leave its' - leave a boring biscuit, and earn a bit of roast chicken. And so on, you build it up from there. There are just loads of exercises, and some get really advanced. Here is the most basic exercise to start with (sorry if you've done things like this and need more advanced things but if so, you'll have to let us know where you've got to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztRNfyErf8s
Hi Peter and Steffi You have adolescent dogs. Also known (by me) as "hell on 4 paws". And "Yes" Steffi I understand exactly why this is the most common time for Labs to be rehomed. Molly, now 2 years old, so we both survived would go from calm(ish) to crazy in the blink of an eye. She would jump up at me, grab my arm in her mouth and fling herself and me from side to side. Like Fiona I am only a light weight and when 25 kilos of dog decides to throw itself around you really feel it. I clung on to fence posts, trees etc. I was very careful where I walked her because I could envisage that if she played up while we were near a busy road we could both wind up in it. I would not have described Molly's behaviour as agressive, though I can understand an observer describing it so. I felt it was a massive burst of energy with nowhere to go. She was totally unrreachable, totally over threshold. I never found a trigger for this behaviour, and believe me I tried. It may have been slightly worse in the early evening, possibly because she was tired. The very worst thing you can do is react. Shouting at them, trying to subdue them won't work, indeed it will just wind them up more. All you can do is hang on in there and weather the storm. And I do know NOT reacting in these circumstances is the very hardest thing to do. Impulse Control is very helpful here. I taught Molly from a very early age by placing a piece of kibble in front of her, telling her to "wait" and she wasn't allowed it until I gave her the release word, which in my case is "OK".
The way you describe it, and especially the timing, makes me think it is the ZOOMIES. When the dog runs around, zooms around, in wild, crazy, demented circles with his butt tucked under. Other terms I've read are butt tucking and FRAP for Frenentic Random Activity Period, as per Brian Kilcommons in his book. Zoomies are a good thing. They are an expression of joy. The day will come when your dog is too old to zoom and you'll be sad to not see them anymore. My dog zooms pretty reliably after a swim and just after we get home from a walk. You'd think he'd be ready to relax after a good off leash walk but no, he usually likes a wild run around the back yard first. I think of it as a last hurrah, that was great, I had fun, I don't want it to end. Of course biting at you as part of the zoomies is not acceptable. Not all dogs do the biting part. Oban, big rough, blunderbuss Oban, doesn't. Jet, petite, gentle, never mouthed or chewed or bit did bite my clothes in zooming, go figure. What I did to get control was assign a name and actively encourage this behaviour. Exactly the same as you do when potty training. I stand in a safe place where I won't get knocked over by the dog and yell, GO, ZOOM, GO. This is establishing control and making a new trigger, as some have said above. Now you can trigger the zoomies, keep them going. Most important you can end them by ending the game and leaving, change your whole body language, stop being encouraging and walk away. If you encouraged in the first place in your own yard you simply go inside. Most dogs want you to participate and when you leave they quit. With Jet I quit when she got to the biting part. With Jet it was most often down the trail she did this, she was off leash, I just walked away down the trail. Obviously a big failure with what I did is the dog who bites right away. Mine didn't till they got really worked up. If yours goes for the biting right at the beginning then the only thing I can think is you need a strong DON'T BITe and a strong FEET, which is my word for not jumping - Feet on the Floor. Good luck. I hope you can get this under control AND preserve the zoomies. Every dog should enjoy a good zoom and every owner should be able to enjoy watching a zoom.
Well Julie i just do some basic stuff like stay hell sit lie down , i don't have a lot of problem to focus him on me if i have treats but for example if someone walks around us he gets distracted or worse if i'm out in the terrace to try some stay or some recall he might start to run like crazy so i haven't really trained a lot when it comes to the recall due to this, it also happen with the stay so i started again with low distance first. I'll also tried to teach him fetch but i have not succeded yet sadly. Thanks for the help same goes for Molly as well i'll take a look at the video
Well the thing is he starts to bite immiedately and then goes for the zoomies or when i give him a new treat he takes it then drops it on the floor followed by a bow play (his butt in the air with the tail wagging like crazy) some bite to the new treat and then spit it out again, repeat this for 3-7 times and THEN THE ZOOMIE it's kinda.... hilarious apart from the biting and the "i gotta have something in my mouth" he also tends to be destructive during the zoomies he tries to get something in his mouth as well, last time he pulled a vase!
What is his overall routine in terms of exercise, walks, and training etc. You say you are training on a terrace? Is that the outside space that you have available to train?
Well when it comes to walk around 30-40 minutes otherwise he tends to foam i had to reduce the length of our walk, while for training 5-10 minutes and for exercises/play no idea i try not to make him too excited
Dogs are all different in their need for exercise to expel energy. But for comparison, when mine was a year old he was getting an off leash outing to the bush where he could run to his heart's content for an hour in the morning and another hour in the evening. He was in classes for one hour a week (competitive obedience) and we trained every day on top of the off leash walks. Some of the outings involved a walk to the bush on leash and we did leash work on them and they are not counted as part of his hours off leash. Are your walks leashed? If so that's probably not adequate exercise unless he's very laid back, which he doesn't sound to be. Not sure what you mean by foam. At his mouth? I frequently see some kind of foamy drool. I guess drool with panting makes for foam? No idea but it doesn't seem to be harmful, except to my clean pants. You will hear it said that a tired dog is a good dog but I myself really don't like that idea. Mental stimulation will also tire a dog out, same as it did us when we had homework at school. Well hey, it did me. If the only means to dispel energy is exercise dogs can just keep getting more and more fit till we mere humans can't hope to keep up. Are you taking any kind of formal training classes? I think a one year old dog should be able to handle more than 5 or 10 minutes of training practice a day. Do you play tug with him? Tug is great for bite control but you might need help training the part where he must give up the tug toy (it's YOURS) when you say so. Some high energy dogs at our trials are rewarded for work by a play of tug. It satisfies their urge to bite and pull, which is what your dog seems to like to do, but they have to work for the privilege of playing tug first.
Yes our walk are leashed mostly because i don't have a place where i could put him off-leash beside i mentioned it already my recall is quite poor! Yes i play tug with him he really likes it but i have to becareful i just ended a session with him and while we were playing when i removed for a sec the toy he bit me on my arms >_>
