Remote training collars

Re: Remote training collars

Many thanks.

 

Re: Remote training collars

There is no reason why you cannot train your dog for gundog work UK style. Check out this site for more info Totally Gundogs You might not be able to win a field trial, but you could still have a lot of fun. There are also a few groups in the USA who put on UK style field trials, I don't know if there are any in your area, but if you google Robert Milner, you'll find out a bit more Hunt tests are a lot of fun too. You can work your way up winning ribbons for each level. I think JH (junior hunter) is the first level.

 

Re: Remote training collars

Thanks for the Robert Milner referral, Pippa. I just spent an hour on his website, reading a bunch of articles. The difference between a British trial and a US one is stark, and I like the description of the British one much more! I sent an email to the "contact us" address, asking if they knew of any trainers in my area with similar philosophies, so I'll have to wait and see what that brings. In the meantime, I'll keep focusing on basic obedience, which is the foundation, I would think, of anything that would come later.

 

Re: Remote training collars

Shock collers hurt, thats the whole idea, a disgusting thing. I am an electrical engineer by trade & have had litraly 100's of shocks over the years & not one of them did I think "oh that wasnt so bad". Its hurts, plain & simple.

If you use one you are hurting your dog on purpose.

 

Re: Remote training collars vs whistles

I've been getting great responses from all three dogs recently, having started using the Acme whistle. I think the going-deaf oldest dog can hear it better, the wide-ranging middle dog has come to realize that the whistle means tasty chicken bits, and the puppy learned really fast that the whistle means treats of all sorts! I have several whistles in various jackets, in the car, and in the house, so I'm seldom without one, plus they're responding pretty well to my (very loud) fingers-in-the-mouth whistle. That one is fine when my hands haven't been occupied in unappealing activities (like pulling decapitated mice out of Daisy's mouth - I wish the barn cat would eat the whole thing!).

Daisy's been doing very well retrieving a scented dummy, but I don't know how to tell her to go right or left or out or in, if she's having trouble finding the dummy. Any tips?

 

Re: Remote training collars

Directional control is quite a big topic. Have a look at this Directional Control

 

I have used E collars on all three of my Labs. I prefer positive rewards based training, but like the option of a little negative reinforcement if it is necessary. I consider it a good walk, if I never use the E collar (Dogtra), but if I have to, it is there as backup. I have tried it on myself, and know it does not hurt much, mostly just gets their attention. I like having it as a backup, since we sometimes walk in places that could be a problem if the dogs did not come back right now.

I wish I had an e-collar option 45 years ago when I had an Alaskan Malamute. His idea of recall, was "I'll get back to you on that" He might have had a lot more off leash time if e-collars had been available then.

Our first Lab, Ginger was a 4 yr old rescue, and while she was very well trained, I did not completely trust her recall initially. Some things were just more important than being told she was a good dog and getting a treat. Her e-collar made it possible to get her off leash very quickly, and know that we had an option if she got too interested in something besides coming back. It did not take long before we kept it in the drawer most all of the time. While I'm a fan of radio controlled e-collars, I do not believe in "invisible fences" We also had one of those, and Ginger would occasionally run though it and then not be able to get back home. If one had a large property and could turn the fence up to cover a wide band, it might work ok, but I think real fences are far better.

 

Actually, electric shocks given to interrupt unwanted behaviour are not negative reinforcement - that is a common source of confusion. They are a form of positive punishment.

Here is an article explaining negative reinforcement http://totallydogtraining.com/what-is-negative-reinforcement-in-dog-training/

And here is one explaining the difference between positive punishment and negative punishment http://thehappypuppysite.com/punishment-in-dog-training/

 

I do agree that off leash freedom is an important aspect of most dog's lives. Fortunately off leash obedience and positive reinforcement training are not mutually incompatible. Most dogs in the UK are walked off leash in the countryside every day. And e-collars are extremely unusual here.

I would like to emphasize to all those reading, (and wondering ) that a rapid and reliable recall can be trained entirely without the use of any aversives whatsoever.

 

It's also worth noting that the Kennel Club is very much against the use of e-collars, and they are banned in many countries. http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/our-resources/kennel-club-campaigns/electric-shock-collars/

(emphasis mine)

 

UKer, Jaime Penrith, of Take the Lead dog Training, has a number of videos and comments on the use of e-collars. The TRENS e-collar in the US is by E-Collar Technologies is presently the most widely used unit by dog trainers. Field and gun dog trainers typically use Sport Dog or Dogtra.

 

People from the UK can be ill-informed, too.

 

@AlphaDog There are many dog trainers who claim to offer force free and positive reinforcement training whilst using methods which constitute positive punishment i.e. e-collars (please see the links above provided by Pippa). Of course owners are entirely free to use whatever methods they wish to train their dogs but the majority of forum members advocate using only positive reinforcement training methods which specifically excludes items like eCollars, choke chains, knees in chest etc. etc

 

Whether they should be or not, is a different matter.

Anyone wanting to sign the petition lobbying to make the sale and use of e-collars illegal in the UK can do so by following the link from the Kennel Club site Fiona links to above...

 

Responses to my post were presumptive. My reply to original poster was neither advocating nor promoting the use of e-collars.

 

My signature has been added .

Sorry, and happy to apologise in advance, but I think I'm a little confused by your comment. If the OP had originally asked for opinions and advice it would seem to be your opinion that eCollars are OK to use because

and that you are advocating or promoting their use because

 

Shock collars (I like to call them what they are) are banned where I live. I expect it's only a matter of time before this is worldwide. Might take a while but the long term trend is towards greater compassion in our management of animals and towards improvements in their welfare.

 

There was a comment earlier that a person had tried the shock on themselves and found it not too bad. I'd like to say that it's not a fair comparison - a person is expecting the shock, so is prepared, knows that it will only be brief and not repeated unless they ask for it. Humans are capable of enduring certain amounts of pain when prepared. And of course the collars must cause the dogs pain or they wouldn't work.
I hope they are banned worldwide.

 

Have signed petition.

A product whose sole intention is to inflict pain is totally abhorrent to me

 

I have signed the petition. Thanks for posting the link @JulieT. xx