We have the most lovable dog - BUT: a rescue dog. Trained for 12 months as a gun dog but "wasn't up to it" We have now had him for 16 months. Very nervous but particularly with my husband - who is the one who wanted the dog in the first place! Outside on walks he is 'normal' - will play with my husband, fetches the ball, begs for biscuits etc but once in the house or garden he cowers, refuses to engage. avoids him etc. My husband walks him every day, feeds him, pets him and generally loves him but with little effect. PLEASE - CAN ANYONE GIVE US ANY ADVICE???
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? It sounds to me as if he's hand some rough treatment at the hands of a man, possibly while undergoing his gundog training but certainly before he came to you. The trouble with rescue dogs is that it can take years to fully rehabilitate them, if at all. The fact that you've had him for 16months already with no improvement would say that it's going to take a long time for him to trust again. I can't really offer a lot of advice but you just need to make sure that every interaction your husband has with the dog is a positive one - he never tells him off, rough handles him or even rough plays with him. It might be good if your husband can make sure he always has treats with him so that whenever he passes the dog or the dog approaches him he can give him a treat and carry on. Small positive interactions like this will help immensely. I wonder whether clicker training may help, perhaps have a look at the thread BAT tips by Jen? Hopefully someone will come along soon with some more advice for you!
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Welcome to the forum from us, Hattie 6 years and our rescue boy Charlie 3 years. I agree with Lauren it sounds like he has had negative gundog training hence he didn't make it poor boy Lauren has given you great advise but like she said you maybe in for the long haul. I don't know if he was kennelled outside and inside is a little stressful for him and whether that would make a difference. However, he sounds a lovely boy. What's his name? It's a tough job taking on a rescue as we know only too well with Charlie, but with love and continuity massive improvements can be made. I can thoroughly recommend BAT techniques and we have had success with Charlie. I wonder if it would help if your husband maybe took him to agility or flyball to strengthen the bond and to have lots of fun together? Helen x
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Hello and a warm welcome from me and my dogs too One of my dogs is also a rescue who was afraid of men when she came to us almost a year ago , but slowly my husband is winning her round with a very softly softly approach, she will now sit on his knee for a cuddle, but even so , if he makes a sudden movement , she shows signs of fear , so yes, it can take a very long time to gain complete trust , just keep on perseverring and hoping for the best outcome
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? I agree with all that's been said. Your husband really needs to be calm and gentle with him. You probably know all this but with nervous dogs it's best to stroke under the chin or possibly the side of the face. Anything coming down onto their head can be seen as dominant aggressive behaviour. Lauren suggestion of your husband carrying treats so when he passes the dog he can just give him one without any other pressure on the dog is a good idea. It's good he will interact with your husband on walks etc. does he play ball with him in the garden? If your husband can find something the dog finds fun to do in the garden that might help. If he won't retrieve for your husband in the garden will he for you? You could throw the ball a few times then your husband do one then you again. Just building up the trust slowly in the garden first more space then inside. I hope you find away to get through to him very soon the poor thing. They certainly broke him and you've got the job of fixing him. Dogs that panic with fear find it difficult to learn so although he is normal with your husband outside he might associate the garden and the home and a man with whatever frightened him and because of that fear association he hasn't been able to learn your husband isn't a threat. I think You need to break that association. The more your husband can do with him and interact with him away from the frightening areas will help. Keeping a nervous dog calm is the hard bit but the only way it can successfully process information. I'm sure somebody will have more useful help than me soon. Good luck and as we say on a regular basis small steps and it will get better.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? I would agree with all that's been said. Make every association with your husband a positive one, especially in the house. It's positive that your dog is happy with you hubby outside the house, that's a good sign! Slow and steady, keep things very gentle and non-threatening between your husband and the pooch, and hopefully things will steadily improve. Do you do any clicker training? Clicking for any positive, dog-initiated movements towards your husband might help to thaw the ice.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? He sounds like a sensitive soul who lost his confidence in the gun dog environment,he sounds much better suited to the caring environment you are providing for him.ive nothing to add to the sound advice you've been given,only to say it appears patience is key,so stick with it and good luck x
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Hi there. Sorry I have no experience myself, but all the advice so far sounds good. Welcome to the forum jac
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Hello, welcome o the forum! I don't have any practical, hands on, experience to offer (sorry) but I do know there are several good books available about helping people in exactly your situation. I'm just reading "do over dogs" by Pat Miller - this is about rescue dogs and coping with the baggage they can bring. I haven't read the fear section yet, but a quick flick through it suggests it could be helpful to you. Having not yet finished the book, I can't really recommend it, but there are plenty of books around. It is not necessarily the case that your dog has experienced rough treatment at the hands of a man - it might be that he was never inside a house with a man, perhaps lived outside in a kennel, and the result is a complete absence of "men inside" socialisation? If you've tried for 16 months, do you think it might be possible to have a couple of sessions with a professional who might help? Perhaps your vet might be able to make a recommendation in terms of finding someone with the right skills to help?
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Wow!! My first approach to the forum and what a warm supportive response - thank you so much everyone!! I've ordered the book, Julie, thanks. You may be right about the indoors/outdoors thing - need to see what to do about it. Did try a couple of sessions with professional help in the early days and was advised what I have been advised by the forum - FOR FREE!! Charlie - thanks for suggestion of classes - will try it. I do know we have had little improvements so am hopeful - it's just such a slow process. He's such a loving, gentle dog I hate to see him scared and nervous!! The different behaviour towards my husband is the baffling thing. Gem (dog) although very comfortable and playful with my husband whilst out walking, he changes dramatically when in the garden or the house.!! If he was the same all the time could be easier to understand. Will interact with me in all situations and is such fun. Sorry I'm rambling - thanks again all of you.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? I find hand feeding a dog forms a very strong bond. Instead of feeding your dog from a bowl your husband could try to hand feed him all his daily food not just treats. It does take several weeks though to take effect.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Forgot to say thanks for the BAT suggestion. I hadn't heard of it before but looks very interesting - will take a closer look
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Welcome to the forum and I can only add that if Gem is a working line labrador, they are often very sensitive; much more so that show bred labs. I know mine is - it is all too easy to put her off ANYTHING by telling her off. So if the man who owned Gem before you used 'traditional' training methods, that might have been too much for him and has resulted in him associating rough treatment with any man - for some reason, particularly at home. Just keep on with what you are doing, being kind to him, and try Heidrun's excellent suggestion of your husband hand-feeding him all his food. Good luck and keep us posted!
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Thanks Karen, I'm sure you're right about the traditional training methods. He had never had treats when we got him so had to sort that out before we could even try to change his behaviour. He loves his treats now and after a lot of work will take them from my husband too. Thank you also to heidrun. We will definitely give that a go.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? The BAT website is www.empoweredanimals.com There is also a book but a lot of it is on the website. I've had to adapt it to work with my two dogs as most of it is based on setups. My dogs are very nervous of strangers so it's not very easy to do setups. I can't really accost strangers on the road to stand still while I BAT them. Although I've come close. : With a bit of altering it might work well with your husband as obviously you can make him stand at the other end of the garden or kitchen while you BAT him. It's worth a go. Although I still complain when we have a wobble my dogs have made a lot of improvement. The thing with nervousness is I don't think (hope I'm proved wrong) it can be fully cured. It's a case of building confidence and changing association so although the fear/nerves are still there the dog can cope. In your case though because Gem will be constantly exposed to your husband in a good way he should over come it very well with time. He might still have issues with other men. What is he like with other men? I hope you find something the works.
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Hi Jen thanks for that. We know he is always going to be nervous. Even with me, although he plays and cuddles he still jumps if there is a sudden movement or noise. He hates any change in routine. He will only eat outside and then only if no one is watching!! The dish must be in the same place. Although if no one is in the house he will eat from his dish inside. He won't just wander into a room - he has to have a spot to go to. A bed or a blanket for example. If both my husband and I are in the room and I offer him treats,he won't take them he will only go to my husband to accept one!. He obviously sees him as the master and watches him all the time he is in. He is wary of all men but not as fearful as with my husband. We have made some progress. When he first arrived he often would cower and urinate when my husband entered the room. We have moves quite a way from that. It's such a shame - with me he is a lively, mad puppy like dog. I so wish my husband could experience it - and that's what he wishes too. We shall keep on trying and won't give up on him!!
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Just wanted to say oh and welcome to the forum I have no advice sorry, but the suggestions you've had so far a brilliant. It sounds like you are doing a fantastic job with him
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? My husband was just the same as yours, he desperately wanted rescue Millie to go to him but she wouldnt , time and patience though has won the day , she jumps on his lap most evenings , so just keep on doing what you and doing, loads of luck
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Poor Gem he's obviously had a tough time with his previous owner and it sounds like he was definitely an outside dog . That's an excellent idea from Heidrun for your husband to hand feed Gem and maybe eventually he will be able to eat inside. Slowly, slowly is going to be the only way and I wish you all the luck in the world with him. You are both doing a wonderful thing bringing Gem into your lives. xx
Re: Will we ever modify his behaviour??? Poor Gem. It's such a shame. I think it sounds like he did receive harsh treatment. Urinating is a sign of fear and submission. I know how hard it is to change a behaviour but I think he has made a lot of progress already to get over that. 16 months seems a long time but when trying to change a deep rooted behaviour/fear its not so the progress you have made is excellent. At least he now has you and your husband to love him and care for him and understand and help him. It will take time but I'm sure one day Gem and your husband will be best friends. Take care and let us know how you get on.
