just reading through your post, quite a few are about retrieve, jasper does not seem interested what so ever in retrieving, i have thrown dummies and balls , he will run to them and just walk away from them,.....what i am training is to walk nice on the lead, good manners, every day things. i have took him in an elevator, car rides, town centre, country walks , children's park areas, woods,my brothers farm with geese , hens, horses ect......my next step is taking him on public transport do any of you think he is missing out on the working dog side of things ? i only got him to be a pet i would hate to think he was missing out on anything
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Lynne , dont panic Some Labs , even working bred ones, just arent interested in " pretend work " . Its nothing you have done or not done and as long as Jasper is happy, which he is , thats all that matters, nothing else . With Sam, his working instinct was very strong from him being a small puppy and so I knew that he had to retrieve, its all he wanted to do . I was confused at first , expecting him to just do pet dog stuff, but then the realisation dawned that this wasnt enough , for Sam , he wanted to work . But Lynne, that isnt the case for all of them , having a happy, contented life is enough for some Labs , Jasper isnt missing out at all x
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Hi Lynne, no you aren't doing anything wrong, it's no problem at all, if Jasper wants to retrieve he will let you know, don't worry! Like Sam, Poppy just HAD to retrieve from the time she was tiny - if she wasn't working and retrieving, she would be out chasing wildlife all over the forest, I am sure. Jasper has a lovely time with you, and you are making sure he is exposed to all sorts of different experiences. Don't worry!!
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Lynne, Charlie is exactly the same I have bought so many things to try and get him interested in retrieving but truthfully he just not very interested. Rabbit skin tennis ball he will sometimes just pick it up drop it and walk past other times he loves it for a very short amount of time, I have only stuck with it to try and get him retrieving because he used to abscond and I feel I need to keep him interested but I don't think it will happen. I think Jac's Lilly is the same no interest. You are doing all the every day things that are important which I have to confess I don't do as I really don't have the time with all the other training Charlie needs so tough I'm afraid. Jasper is a great boy and he is your pet and a lucky boy too so don't worry. All this gundog stuff is a mystery to me and something I am not interested in either and it's not essential at all Helen x
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Well Helen, I'd say that depends on the dog... It is pretty much essential for dogs like Sam and Poppy, as well as many others on this forum, but obviously not so for others like Charlie, Jasper, or Lily... and you are right, it also depends on the owner's interests too, although it would probably be tempting fate to get a working strain dog if you are absolutely dead set against any form of gundog training and just want a family pet. Some breeders are at fault here too. I met a woman recently who was searching for her labrador bitch. Eventually the dog turned up after about 30 minutes where she had been rampaging around in the forest. The woman was very distraught, and said that when she got the dog, she had no idea that she was a working strain lab, this was her first dog and she had just bought the puppy on the understanding it would be a family pet and nothing more, since everyone had told her what wonderful dogs labradors are. Now she has a dog that runs away and hunts all the time (sorry Helen, you are probably having deja vu at this point!!!). I really cannot understand how the breeder could have done that, without carefully explaining what sort of dog he was selling!
Re: am i doing something wrong ? phewwww, thank goodness,.....he is a very placid boy,apart from when he wants to play with other dogs.....when i take logan to the park he is more than happy to sit by the swings watching him he is a big softie and just wants to lick other dogs i prefer to do the every day thing.......these are things i have not done my self in a number of years ;D he as helped me so much, onwards and upwards happy dog happy owner karen i have all the time in the world if jasper was interested then i would be interested and would join any thing it took for my boy to be happy, he never goes far away from me there seems to be no hunting in him, think he would prefer to be amongst children having all the attention he can
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Lynne, Jasper sounds a joy to own and also sounds very contented with his lot in life and thats all that matters, truly
Re: am i doing something wrong ? thanks kate, will let you know how the bus ride goes, if that goes well i will take him on a train he is a very happy boy
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Karen, I identified with your story about the woman searching for her Labrador bitch. We bought Lady for my daughter in complete innocence of the difference between a working breed and a show/pet bred lab. She was a complete nightmare and has only just calmed down now at the age of 4. Our breeder didn't explain the difference either, and looking at her pedigree she is 100% working stock. If she hadn't got a strong retrieving drive, I wouldn't have given it a second thought, but really more in order to give Lady something to do that played to her instincts was what got me going on the retrieving stuff following the advice of some friends who have working dogs and work them. We have other friends with Labs who don't do any retrieving at all with them and I think that's related to the dog's temperament. Our Lady, belonged to my daughter at first before we took her on at the age of 6 months. She was a replacement for her beloved Libby who died at the age of around 12 or 13. Libby was a lovely Lab and quite a different temperament to Lady. Very quiet and very steady with no interest in retrieving at all. I think they are all just different, and all lovely dogs whatever their drive is. Just right now Lady has no drive at all as she's flat out in the garden basking in the sunshine. ;D Sorry rambled on a bit there!
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Lynne,sometimes when you read what everyone else is doing it does make you question what you are doing I know I do!but you have done a marvellous job with Jasper....i cant do any of the daily activities you do,OMG I would get arrested of I took him on the bus......seriously!!!and your lead walking would put us to shame :-[ We decided on Dexter because we knew the breeder,our friends have dogs from him and the breeder was experienced with exporting dogs abroad ......So with those factors in the decision....a working dog it was!Chris to this day has not read ONE dog book!!!!he has no idea about Dexters needs I was always aware that this would be the case.....not doing him down in anyway,he has very little spare time and NO knowledge of dogs .....so the green light on getting a dog was always down to me because I knew his care would fall to me!I therefore began the reading and researching in earnest : realizing that quite possibly I could have a handful on my hands.......Chris listened to my reports back,and nodded sagely,then roll his eyes at me as he imagined himself walking along the roads of our community with his Andrex dog walking calmly to heel!Yeah Right!Dexter is as chilled as they come when the house is at rest and we are all settled....he could quite easily snooze the day away but once he realises there is some action he is right in there and he has a lot of energy that needs to be harnessed and occupied. I've got more confidence to try different things now as I've seen the results of total recall....and now that we are really just proofing that in different situations...there is a gap in our walks that I think it would be fun to fill...lets see,we don't need to do anything perfectly it's an activity and stimulation for him just trying.... Once you've got Jasper comfortable on the train ,you will have to bring him up to Liverpool for a visit when I'm back on one of my whirlwind visits....would love to see you both
Re: am i doing something wrong ? I totally appreciate that dogs like Sam and Poppy and others do need to retrieve and do gun dog stuff, but it is really difficult for those of us that have dogs that don't want to retrieve like Charlie and when you've tried everything possible for 2 years it causes me a great deal of concern when I cannot get this side going and I am worried that he is going to start going off again. When I read all the great things you all do with your dogs I feel quite inadequate and wished I had not even read them. I live in a rural area where there are no end of Labs and many other gun dog breeds and I truly do not see anyone do all this gun dog business. All I see every day is people walking in the countryside with their dogs. My neighbour is a very experienced gun dog owner of 2 labs and has had them all his life and when we went to chat to him about Charlie he told us he never does any such work with his dogs and they are so well trained as working dogs he rents them out for shoots when he is not attending. Not a dummy or ball in sight. Enjoy what you do that's all I meant and I am sorry if it came across differently. Helen x
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Helen!If you ever feel inadequate( which you have no business feeling )read my posts....they are guaranteed to make you feel good about yourself ;D ;D ; Everyone is doing so many different things on here which is what makes the forum so interesting....and addictive ;D I love reading about yours and Charlie's adventures....and steady good girl Hattie when she pops up on here! Everybody's dogs,family life,resources,finances,outlook,available free time( the list goes on....) are different, but we all have in common that we love our dogs and are trying to do the best for them whatever that may be....you have done a brilliant job with Charlie....you have given and are continuing to give him just what he needs....it's been yours and your family's special skill set that have got him to the level he is at now x
Re: am i doing something wrong ? angela, jasper is not perfect on the lead although he does not pull now unless he sees another dog, also yesterday i walked him into town he was a bit nervous at times but he coped well,.....i .took him in the elevator, he didn't bat an eye lid i am very lucky that my son is very supportive, we work as a team , he used to take him for his evening walks, now i go with him to make sure he trains him as i do the thing is my mark was saying jasper never pulls him, so i decided to go along with him, i soon realised the reason why he was pulling, my son is 18 stone plus, so to him he was holding him back when he pulled with no heel work what so ever, that as all changed, he as lost 100s of balls as he don't want to bring them back to us, he as no interest in wild life,apart from wanting to play with a butterfly he is turning out just the way i wanted him to, ....i spend a lot of time with logan so when we visit the park jasper is just happy to watch all the kids playing thankfully hellen no way are you inadequate, you are doing an amazing job, i was beginning to question myself when i read what other dogs are doing,...now i just see myself as very lucky to have got my dream boy,......keep up the good work helen
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Oh Helen, I am so sorry if I can accross as being Belittling in any way whatsoever , I truly didnt mean to . Sam did have formal 1-1 lessons but hasnt done for some considerable time now, so its just me and him, getting it far from perfect most of the time, dont feel bad x
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Helen, you should never feel inadequate - ever! full stop ! You've done wonders with Charlie and should be proud of yourself and all your hard work x I think your neighbour must have amazing dogs as all the gundogs I've met have been the product of a lot of time and effort and there's nothing wrong with that!!! Any suggestion that good dogs are simply born and not made is, in my personal opinion, nonsense! The best gundogs would, I imagine, have good breeding but they are certainly the product of training. I could feel inadequate too as, if an experienced person had Riley, he would be off shooting by his current grand old age of 2 and a half. Instead he's stuck with me and my mistakes. It will take us a lot longer but we're enjoying the journey (mostly ) So let's all be proud of our achievements - small or large 8)
Re: am i doing something wrong ? [quote author=charlie link=topic=2471.msg24373#msg24373 date=1378386067] I totally appreciate that dogs like Sam and Poppy and others do need to retrieve and do gun dog stuff, but it is really difficult for those of us that have dogs that don't want to retrieve like Charlie and when you've tried everything possible for 2 years it causes me a great deal of concern when I cannot get this side going and I am worried that he is going to start going off again. When I read all the great things you all do with your dogs I feel quite inadequate and wished I had not even read them. I live in a rural area where there are no end of Labs and many other gun dog breeds and I truly do not see anyone do all this gun dog business. All I see every day is people walking in the countryside with their dogs. My neighbour is a very experienced gun dog owner of 2 labs and has had them all his life and when we went to chat to him about Charlie he told us he never does any such work with his dogs and they are so well trained as working dogs he rents them out for shoots when he is not attending. Not a dummy or ball in sight. Enjoy what you do that's all I meant and I am sorry if it came across differently. Helen x [/quote] Oh goodness Helen, please please dont ever feel inadequate, you have done so much with Charlie, many people would have given up ages ago, but you have kept on. He is clearly a happy dog with you now, and I know things may never be totally easy with him, but I am completely impressed with what you have done and continue to do. It's just that I get joy and fulfillment out of working with Poppy, and I am aware every day how lucky I am to have such an uncomplicated and biddable dog. Truly, the retrieving and so on is not down to me, as David said (I think) it is more harnessing the natural drive and energy of the dog. I love the opportunity to discuss aspects of training on here, and actually have a couple of questions regarding training of certain retrieves, maybe I should put them on the gundogs site, but I feel friends with so many people on here, and many of us are beginners so I like to hear their experiences too... But I am absolutely with you, not everyone or every dog needs or is even interested in gundog stuff! Good thing too, or we'd be knee deep in dummies! Sorry Lynne, we seem to have taken over your thread! I am totally impressed with your plans to take Jasper on the bus too! Never tried that one...
Re: am i doing something wrong ? oh god, what have i done starting this post :'( please lets just be happy
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Kate you could never belittle anyone at all and you certainly have not done so with me I promise Karen you must always chat about your successes with the lovely Poppy as I know how much you enjoy your training as lots of others do also. I want to hear everyones success which I hope will help me, so please post away. Please don't go onto the gun dog site as I don't know how to get to that I have a real issue and mistrust of gun dog trainers especially the ones I have been to as they have both suggested barbaric methods to train Charlie :'( So trying to find one that will not treat Charlie badly because of his history is pretty impossible around here unless I travel a long way which isn't possible with a young family to care for. I am truly happy for those of you that have found genuine trainers with positive training methods and wish you all great fun. Sorry Lynne we are all happy and friends, just a misunderstanding. Helen xxxxx
Re: am i doing something wrong ? Helen, I liked what you said in your post on another thread today (brain is mush so can't remember which - think it was the retrieving one) "Charlie used to be an absconder......" Enough said.
Re: am i doing something wrong ? i love this site because there is such a mix of us with different dogs...i have Brodick, who lives to hunt but is getting into retrieving now but not nearly as much as cuillin who is completely obsessed. yesterday we spent the mornings big walk retrieving loads and brods got really into it and did tonnes. roll on to the night time shorter walk, cuillin was begging to retrieve, i got the dummy out and bless him brodick sat down and whined!! like, oh lord no not more retrieving ;D. luckily i found him an enormous log and threw it about and while cuillin retrieved he attacked his log, rolled on it, chewed it, and ran around it barking happily...each dog to his or her own!! helen id love to find a positive trainer too...the posts here have inspired me to try again... lynne my two both go on buses and go from edinburgh to newcastle by train once a month, they really quickly learnt teain means settle and be good though i found peanut butter a great help
