I am really enjoying Harley more and more. She hit a bit of a defiant stage at about 7 months but it was very mild and to be honest, I like the spirit. She is such a lovely dog. We still have plenty zoomies but if we ignore it she will chase her tail and run up and down for a bit make a growly noise, with her bum tucked and then the next minute she will flop down and have a nap. But I have noticed that Harley almost seems to be "looking" for being involved in carrying things and training. We don't do as much training with her as we used to, she does all the basics well. So now we click and reward if we have the clicker with us or we use verbal rewards with a treat mostly. Still lots of play and walks but there is just this feeling like she is capable of much more than we are doing with her. I am a really rubbish trainer so the thought of doing more complex things intimidates me. But should I be trying harder for her? We have enrolled her for a "Clicks and tricks" class at the same positive reinforcement trainer that we have been with since she was a little pup. So I will see how that goes. It is a very fun, light hearted class. Should I have more ambition for her? Or am I projecting my need for personal achievement and development on our lab?
I can empathise with you , as I used to worry terribly that I wasn't " enough " for Sam who showed signs of being a passionate retriever . If you do feel that Harley would benefit from some gundog training , try a couple of lessons as a starter, to see how you both get on , its all about you learning too ! I was never going to work Sam , but I did want him to learn the art and I wanted to know how to bring the best out of him too and don't feel intimidated , Sam has no finesse , he falls far short of what a true working dog would achieve !. However, please don't stress too much about it , most Labradors will be quite happy being a pet and nothing more . Harley sounds delightful and a credit to you x
Many of us have been there, to some degree or another. "My dog would be amazing, if only s/he had a better handler.". "Am I letting my dog down by not training him/her to her full capability?", etc etc. Your dog doesn't have the foggiest how good a handler you are. Your dog doesn't have the foggiest what her potential is. Even if she did, she wouldn't care. As long as she is loved, fed, exercised and stimulated, that's all she cares about. She doesn't measure her achievements against some arbitrary scale. If you want to get involved with some dog sports - which could be anything from agility to flyball to gundog training to CaniX to doggy dancing to rally-o to scentwork... there are so many to choose from - then go for it! You have nothing to lose and potentially a lot to gain. If you don't enjoy it, no harm done, you just don't pursue it. But don't feel you have to do anything more than just enjoy each other. That just puts pressure on you all, and spending time with your dog should be fun
You are both right. I know Harley doesn't care about how awful I am as a trainer or compare herself to other dogs, I suppose it is me just thinking 'wow, she is clever and doing stuff together is fun for both of us'. She picks up on things really quickly and she is so keen that it is great to do things with her. I also think a big part of this is that she isn't 100% food driven. She likes treats but she really likes attention and praise. I don't think I want to do anything official with her, like competitions. I never even thought of doing more with her than the training for CGC so I need to expand my knowledge of the options.
I have done a fair bit with Plum and am currently doing some gundog training classes with her. I'm not planning on working her I just enjoy the bond that classes together encourages. I also find classes motivate me. I also plan to check out flyball when she's old enough coz she's fast and tennis ball crazy! I'm not sure if I felt I 'should' do the classes, I think I was just interested to see what may come of them. However, the three labs I grew up with had no training and were lovely companions who enriched our lives. I also used to look after two labs of friends, neither of whom had done any training, and they too were much-loved, well-behaved companions.
I decided to train mine as gundogs after I saw their parents (who belong to friends and so I knew long before the pups ever came along), doing a sit-stay while their owner went and fed the chickens. Going out of sight to get the feed from an outhouse, then going into the chicken enclosure, scattering it around and collecting eggs. The dogs didn't move a muscle. I was amazed and, when the puppies came along, with the whole story of how that all happened, I knew I wanted to do something that gave me a dog as half as well trained as that. If I lived in the UK, I would certainly pursue working them, and I would certainly look at doing some working tests, but, other than a small chance here and there to be involved in those things, it's not to be. But, I find it amazing how much the dogs love to do their bits and pieces of training, how much I learn about them by doing it and how far they progress, even with all of my shortcomings as a handler. I'm largely self-taught, along with some brilliant help from the people on this forum, and it's all "just for fun". There's definitely no need for any pressure, and I find it hugely addictive. Something else to maybe think about is doggy activity holidays. We took W&S to a place in France where they run agility lessons. We had a week of private lessons, and all absolutely loved it! We had two hours (IIRC) of lessons in the mornings and then the rest of the day to ourselves, taking the dogs for a walk around the nearly river and lakes, practicing things we'd learnt etc. It was huge fun and the dogs were completely zonked each night
This seems like a great next step, especially at 7 months old. I did a similarly-titled class with Brogan at about that age and it was blast. It also gave me a lot more confidence and taught me that even "big tricks" are just little steps strung together. For example, teaching him the trick of ringing a bell with his nose meant I learned to target which meant I could teach the more complex service dog behaviours. At this age, I'd say do some different stuff, figure out what you and she like to do, and go from there. It's supposed to be fun and unless you are training towards a specific job (like Mags with her guide dog walking), then don't worry about a schedule or agenda. Just enjoy the time with Harley!
As a trainer I ask my clients first and firemost what is they want from their dog. Do they want an agility champion, a FT Champ, a Show Champ or a dog with the skills to live comfortably in our modern fast paced society with the high level of expectations we have of our dogs. Walking comfortably on a loose lead and ignoring other dogs is practice, recall is practice, not reacting to noises is socialisation/habituation and practice. Not reacting to people wearing sunglasses, hats, with beards - you name it, it all comes down to socialisation/habituation and practice. Sit/stay with the owner disappearing to do jobs is practice - I can put the dogs dinner on the floor (a sit is a default behaviour) walk away and do jobs and then come and send them for their food it's just practice. There's absolutely nothing wrong with not doing 'training', I don't do much 'training' with my dogs but I practice trained behaviours out on walks, in the garden, in town, at train stations, in dog friendly pubs and cafés and extend expectations as we go. Enjoy Harley and the lovely companion she is maturing into , I think you've been doing a great job 'training' her
I do agree that everything is just practice, but the wonderful thing about doing "activities", rather than just general day-to-day obedience is that the boring things get practiced a lot in order to gain access to the exciting things. When dull behaviours, such as walking to heel or sit-stays are rewarded by a retrieve, or the chance to go over a jump, those boring parts become part of a hugely enjoyable whole, so I think that, in general, it is a lot easier to reach a higher standard of those boring things in a faster time than if you were just teaching them as individual skills. But, as @Jojo83 says, you have to decide what it is you want from your dog. My lot are brilliant around the house generally, but I've never bothered to train certain everyday things, like a strong "on your bed" cue, or sitting on a mat while we eat, because it's not important to me. I'd rather spend my training time doing other things. So, occasionally, one will try to stick their noses in our dinner. We'll block it and they'll wander off. That's good enough for me. It wouldn't be for other people. The thing is, the more things you train, the better you get at training, and the better your dog gets at learning, which means every subsequent thing becomes easier.
The thing is - doing stuff with your dog is FUN, for both of you, and increases your bond. Whatever you find interesting, just give it a go. There's no pressure, you can stop whenever you want. But be warned - it might grab you (and Harley) and change your life...
I doubt this for one minute @Harley Quinn - Harley sounds a very happy Labrador so whatever you are doing, you are doing it right. It is interesting your thoughts though. Apart from fundamentals, Sky had little training. She never went to training classes of any kind. She has been the most contented Labrador ever and just gone with the flow of family life. She has always been included where appropriate in events - Parties, BBQ's, holidays, visiting family and friends and I have always felt proud of her (apart from her having a useless Recall and running off several times when she was young ). I suppose we were always busy particularly during her early years and she just fitted in. I feel differently about Red and I am not sure why. She and I are currently doing Scentwork classes for fun and I want to keep her brain active. I feel the need to train her although I am learning as I go and feel rubbish myself some days . I want to have a good relationship with her and she with me but I have an excellent one with Sky so the need to train doesn't make sense. I suspect whatever you do with Harley will be the right thing as you are considering her needs and what makes her happy and we all want a happy dog .
I didn't feel a real need to go to lots of training classes with Hattie, we went to puppy training and worked our way up to obedience classes which we attended for 18 months. I am hugely proud that Hattie is a PAT dog. Above all Hattie is my best friend, to walk with and explore the countryside, she is my shadow and I can't even begin to imagine my life without her. I value her friendship more than my human friends. I felt real pressure to go to training classes with our rescue Charlie because he was such a difficult dog and I have always wanted the best for him. I tried lots of classes non of which helped him and I didn't enjoy them. We went it alone and achieved far more and I do feel quite proud of what we have achieved with Charlie, he loves us and his life with us. I don't think a dogs bond will be any different whether you go to classes or not. I do training with both dogs during walks, in the garden, tricks, clicker training and they are happy so what more could I possibly want. Our dogs our with us for such a very short time so I say enjoy them, don't feel pressurised into joining this class, of course people do enjoy them so you could give it go if you want to. Time really does disappear, I can hardly believe Hattie is coming up 10 years old but I enjoy every minute with her as she does with me and she is laying across my feet as I type As long as our dogs are fed, have a warm bed, we give them important training to keep them safe and some fun training too but above all are loved, cuddled and cherrished they really don't want, need or care about anything else. xx
We didn't train with Belle at all. She just bimbled along in life, was no real trouble and she joined in when she felt like it. Coco, on the other hand, has needed a lot of training due to his size and strength and his boisterousness. I have found I enjoy it immensely, and Coco seems to thrive on it too. He's often pestering me to do stuff in the morning (I work afternoons). I'll sit down for a cuppa - he wants to be doing something - just simple training, fetching, games etc. We train when we're walking too - never did this with Belle. I think he probably would enjoy training for something too, but so far I'm too lazy - I don't think that really matters - he doesn't know he's missing out on agility or doggy dancing or whatever - he just loves learning anything I teach him.
Unfortunately those dull boring behaviours are taught first and not usually with a retrieve at the end if it as a reward. I don't train a 'heel' walk and neither do any trainers I know - for the average of owner what is the purpose apart from 'look at me' in the park or on walks. I don't train much of a sit/stay come to that - but then I'm not an "Obedience" trainer and dislike the use of the word. I train my clients to train their dogs to live comfortably in their homes, with their families and safely in their environments. In my experience if a dog is bored in training look at the activity or look at the trainer - whatever you're training it should be fun. If the dog isn't enjoying it, you're doing it wrong
I'd disagree with that entirely. We certainly start with games based around retrieving patterns as very young puppies, right alongside the heel work and sit/stays. So it is almost always a small part of a bigger whole, and gets proofed very quickly because of the value of that "whole". I also disagree there is little value in those exercises. I think a good heel is immensely valuable to the average dog owner (which is all I am), who has to walk their dog on busy streets, or to walk past other people/obstacles in the countryside. Similarly a sit/stay - I want to be able to have my dog sit while I cross an obstacle (say, a stile, a narrow section of path, or a rough bridge) and not come until called. Not for long durations, maybe, but a solid sit/stay for a minute or so is definitely a very practical thing to teach.
I taught my lab in a much more traditional sequence - heelwork, sit/stay etc before the fun stuff really kicked in. My spaniel is a completely different kettle of fish and if it wasn't all part and parcel of a fun game we weren't getting anywhere. The second process has been more enjoyable from the off and it will be this or a variation of that I train future dogs regardless of breed.
come/sit/down/heel (well loose lead) are the fundamentals I want as a pet dog owner. The sits and downs are pretty much bomb proof now. They are used all the time, daily, so they do get rewarded with a huge variety of actions/treats. This should be a lesson for me - how to reward.
