Re: Back to School For Us! Just wanted to add something I'd forgotten. Obviously automatic look at me when a trigger is approaching always gets a mark and big reward. That's the look at me you want but just incase it doesn't happen I have my cue. It will be very interesting what the trainer says about Dex s interaction with other dogs. My dogs play rough with each other. Sometimes I feel Scott gets too rough. Look at me stops it instant. Keep working on that and it can be used in all sorts of circumstances even cats. I dont think you fuss too much. I would much rather meet an owner like you out and about. One who cares how their dog behaves. My life would be a lot easier if there were more owners like you around us. ;D
Re: Back to School For Us! I've remembered a tip to get guaranteed eye contact on your look at me. Sorry if you already know it. Treat in your hand, cue look at me and move your hand to your chest just under your chin. Scott and Scout automatically sit as well. I suppose the upward movement of the hand is a bit like luring the sit. After you've done that for a bit you don't need the treat. You end up with a look at me cue that means look at me with eye contact and a hand signal. When I move my hand to that position S&S will automatically sit and make eye contact with out a verbal cue. Obviously they need to already be looking to see the hand signal so might seem a bit pointless. :. However I find it a good way to keep their attention/focus on me if there are distractions.
Re: Back to School For Us! [quote author=Dexter link=topic=7808.msg109467#msg109467 date=1410713190] I think my perception may be skewed because he's my first dog.I know some owners think I fuss too much ,but I do always think dexter is the strongest and most boisterous and I'd hate to be thought of as an irresponsible owner who let's her dog get away with bad behavior.....I do this a lot....ie worry about what other dog owners think of us :-[ [/quote] I think you might need to relax a bit. After spending several sessions with the dog communications people, Dex does not sound so unusual for a young labrador to me. Our labradors are often over friendly, over enthusiastic and a bit much for lots of dogs. That does not mean that they should cause a well socialised adult dog to faint or panic! Far from it. That would be like saying it's ok for a slightly rude human teenager to receive a skull breaking whack round the head with a walking stick if they queue jump! It sounds like you need to work on Dex responding right away to your whistle and come away from other dogs when you call. But he honestly does not sound unusual. He does not sound like he is a "predator" which would end in serious tears! He sounds a bit keen to meet other dogs. A well socialised adult dog would cope fine with this behaviour. Yes, it might be a bit rude. But the world is full of puppies, young dogs, dogs with eyes too close to the front, border Collies that appear odd to anything but other border Collies....a well socialised dog should not collapse in a panic because a dog is a bit keen to say hello. Deep breath! Relax! You have a normal young labrador!
Re: Back to School For Us! Several things in your reply Julie home right into the crux of the matter....... [quote author=JulieT link=topic=7808.msg109550#msg109550 date=1410727000] I think you might need to relax a bit. [/quote] Right on the nail :-[ I know! :-\ I met a German lady on Saturday with her elderly JRT off lead,I called Dexter back before he saw her and we waited on lead until they got a bit closer and practiced our 'look at me' She called out' can they play' and I replied my usual saying he's a bit bouncey and strong and he might upset her,she looked at me a bit weirdly and said 'look at the dogs,they are fine,my dog wouldn't go near a dog that is aggressive ,it's you being anxious that will cause a problem' :-[ I would have let him off anyway,I'm not that bad : but I do always let a little dog get close to us to take the speed and energy out of his run up! She was dead right,they were absolutely fine .....and Dexter does adjust his play....slightly : with a little dog . [quote author=JulieT link=topic=7808.msg109550#msg109550 date=1410727000] It sounds like you need to work on Dex responding right away to your whistle and come away from other dogs when you call. [/quote] Absolutely.....what happened was I ran out practice resources when I was working through Total Recall and kind of got to the ' well we are good enough and no one else to practice with so let's live with it' stage It was at that point that I should have gone to work with a trainer at one of the dog schools .It wouldn't have been out in the park we use but I still could have drilled and drilled it around different dogs.....that's what I'm hoping to be able to do now....so I guess better late than never.... [quote author=JulieT link=topic=7808.msg109550#msg109550 date=1410727000] He does not sound like he is a "predator" which would end in serious tears! [/quote] Now you see that hits right to the target of my worry :-\ With a view to having control over him if we brought him back to the UK next Summer I've been reading up on Chase training and behaviours ( I know we've both just read the same book by David Ryan) I've got myself worried from reading when he details the stages of hunting....Dexter mimics it all up to the chase point ....and if it's a big dog,I have seen him nip at a back leg at times as they both go haring off and him trying to get a hold on the back of the neck .....I've seen other dogs doing this too so this is where I think my lack of exposure to dogs playing let's me down.My knowledge about what is acceptable mimicry of a wild dogs behaviour by a domestic dog in a play situation is lacking.Because I've seen him trying to have a nip,I step in if what I call his 'turbo switch 'kicks in.We calm down ,have a break and then I let play start again.I'm hoping being able to just hang out at the dog training school to observe play and excitement levels will help me with this .......I'm making him sound like a horror aren't I? :'( :'( :'( please don't think for a minute that every interaction with another dog off lead is a primeval hunt : and Dexter loves nothing more than to be chased himself and have someone playing bitey face on him : We meet new dogs everyday and play with them,I've just got home from swimming in the lakes with an 8 month old beagle pup and a golden retriever......and we had a lovely ,energetic ,boisterous time at what I consider an appropriate play level.Pup showed his tummy when he'd had enough,the GR and Dexter backed off straight away.... He's not at all bad ;D but I want to get a good understanding of him to do him justice and to really enjoy him and stay safe. I'll be interested to see how he gets on tomorrow and what they say about him Blimey this post has turned into a bit of a therapy session....sorry folks I better go and clean the ferocious beast's teeth now! ;D Have a great day x
Re: Back to School For Us! Gosh Angela, you should see how roughly Poppy plays with some other dogs! Honestly, the growling and grabbing and rushing around, you'd think she was a completely dominant aggressive madam, where as actually she is a little angel! She grabs her friend Paulina by the scruff and pushes her to the ground growling and snarling, but it's all part of their game. Dexter sounds very normal to me too.
Re: Back to School For Us! He does, he sounds totally normal for a young Labrador. I reckon if he and Obi met they'd both run at each other full pelt, skip sideways in the same direction and promptly knock each other out.
Re: Back to School For Us! Yup normal here too Much nibbling on scruffs goes on and rolling around on the floor growling with big open mouths. I take their collars off and leave them to it until the noise levels get ridiculous and then we break up the party!! We've been working on our focus and we're definitely seeing improvement. You can do it xxx
Re: Back to School For Us! Angela, are you sure Dexter isn't Molly's older brother. I have exactly the same problem, she wants to bounce and be "Bessie mates' with every dog she sees. I keep her on the lead, warn owners that 'she is very bouncy' and if they are happy with that, I let her off. Interestingly there is one dog that Molly doesn't want to play with. It's a little white thing, Molly always lays down when she sees it. The owner says to Molly "I don't blame you for not wanting to play with her, she's not a very nice dog" Although we, as humans recognise some of the more obvious canine messages (wags, tails down etc) it is obvious that there is much more to this canine communication lark than we mere humans are privy to.
Re: Back to School For Us! Harley can play very rough with next doors lab - at first I was terrified they were hurting each other but over time (and with hubby and neighbours reassuring me) I have found out that this is how they are. If one goes OTT, the other will tell them off. I used to be really anxious every time they played, but am now a lot more relaxed. It will come over time xx
Re: Back to School For Us! It's a great idea to get a trainer to have a look - it'll put your mind at rest, I bet. [quote author=Dexter link=topic=7808.msg109603#msg109603 date=1410763265] Now you see that hits right to the target of my worry :-\ With a view to having control over him if we brought him back to the UK next Summer I've been reading up on Chase training and behaviours ( I know we've both just read the same book by David Ryan) I've got myself worried from reading when he details the stages of hunting....Dexter mimics it all up to the chase point .... [/quote] Dex might just be doing the immature flat-creep-flat-rush: "I'll go flat on my tummy to show I'm good to play with....can't resist creeping forward....do you want to play?...come on, come on, let's play...oh I can't help myself, I've got to just rush over because I KNOW you want to play really..." I honestly see this everyday at the Common. Charlie sometimes gets a bit confused by it, but that's because he is still just a kid himself and doesn't always know what to do - we're working on him knowing what to do in more situations though. It's immature, but it's pretty normal and sensible adult dogs recognise it for what it is - and if they give a single, controlled growl at the final rush up, so much the better. It's how dogs learn.
Re: Back to School For Us! Exactly Julie! Sounds like almost every young lab that I know. And I really agree about letting dogs play and interact, so that they learn the social rules from one another. Not quite so easy in Dubai, I know Angela, but I think you need to try and trust Dexter a bit more.
Re: Back to School For Us! Ah thanks everyone,I bet I'm driving you all mad with my 'play analysis' ....let's see what tomorrow's report brings....
Re: Back to School For Us! [quote author=Karen link=topic=7808.msg109659#msg109659 date=1410770452] Gosh Angela, you should see how roughly Poppy plays with some other dogs! Honestly, the growling and grabbing and rushing around, you'd think she was a completely dominant aggressive madam, where as actually she is a little angel! She grabs her friend Paulina by the scruff and pushes her to the ground growling and snarling, but it's all part of their game. Dexter sounds very normal to me too. [/quote] Wow.....could be Lilly you are referring to. None of the other dogs we meet are that growly, I thought it was plain bad manners, but guess we are in good company with half the forum dogs!
Re: Back to School For Us! Ummm....that would be very much frowned on at Charlie's comms class. I'm not saying it's not normal, particularly between dogs that are siblings, live in a "pack" or know each other very, very well. But the rule for play in the class is no paw on another dog. Gentle scruff grabs during chasey games acceptable, but no more. I'm talking about dogs that don't know each other very well. I'll ask about it next time - it's possible I've got a skewed view of course...
Re: Back to School For Us! No, I think you're spot on, Julie. It's only with dogs that Pops knows very well where she is so full on. And she only hoolies around at gun dog class at the end of training, when we let them run around and let off steam. Angela, as I said before, I think Dexter still needs to learn the finer rules of doggy etiquette. But that doesn't mean he's out of the ordinary, or out of control.
Re: Back to School For Us! Oh well his report has come back mixed.......and in some parts he sounded like a dog I don't know :-\ I'm trying to remember everything correctly as it was given to me verbally, I haven't had it in email yet but wanted to just drop in with the an update because you have all been so kind x He is very attached to me and his anxiety levels and inability to settle down after I left weren't normal.....apparently he paced around one of the training rooms sniffing and investigating and wouldn't interact/ play with the trainer or settle down.She brought a GR dog in and he played ok but got bored quickly ( he does that in his regular play group in the park,but I'm there introducing new toys and games to hold his interest,otherwise he does go self employed) the trainer then played with him again and she said he was more responsive this time .she praised his recall, focus and basic obedience saying they were all very good. A second dog was brought in then and she said that didn't go so well,Dexter was tense ,his body stiff and leaning forward and he was putting his nose over the dog .......she ended the interaction ??? So I guess she wasn't comfortable.It was break time then when the daycare dogs all get a rest period in a kennel on their own with a stuffed kong.....I'd taken my own in as I didn't want him getting the squirts off something his tummy isn't used to.She rang me to give me an update so I said I'll come and get him....when I picked him up he HADNT eaten the kong....that is completely unbelievable to me and backs up the theory that he was anxious.She also said he is uncomfortable around people he doesn't know....I knew that,he isn't a fussy dog,he doesn't seek out attention or fuss for affection.If we have company he barks for the first minute or so ( or it feels like that maybe it's not even that long) then he either goes on his bed and ignores them or mooches around the group hanging out by me really ,he doesn't like having his head patted,he quite obviously ducks but he tolerates any handling.So she hasn't really seen his play ??? Anyway ,we are booked in for a 121 tomorrow lead walking practice around other dogs which that,and recall away from other dogs is what I need to practice ..... I don't know ........we are walking past other dogs much better just in this last week....tonight I used my stop whistle .......just to keep him thinking and watching me and that got us past a really reactive dog that Dexter would have usually been on full alert at.... Anyway we had a nice play with the regular pals in the park tonight ,he is calm and relaxed mostly around dogs of all sizes he knows . https://www.flickr.com/photos/97066992@N03/15256036861/ All good and easy going although he and the GR have some right big wrestles at times but if a new dog had appeared during this vid....Dex would have shown his high alert position and been a yellow blur deaf to me and not be seen for dust! ;D Im starting to understand that the unknown ,dogs,people,places does seem to make him nervous and that can explain the body language and reactions I see.Makes me sad ,but I'll help him as much as I can and hopefully we can get his confidence up x Thanks for all the time you've taken to reply to me ,it's really helped at a time when I've been trying to pick my way through what is happening xxx
Re: Back to School For Us! I hope tomorrow is better for you and Dexter hopefully the 1-2-1 will be useful for you both Some dogs don't go with other people easily, unless they know them. My hubby took Harley to his mums house, nipped out to his van and left Harley with his mum. She barked constantly and kept sitting by the door until hubby came back in. When I take her to my friends house (the one with Bruno), she doesn't even look back if we leave her there for a few hours! Keep your chin up let us know how tomorrow goes xx
Re: Back to School For Us! The opportunities to practice on-lead sound good Great to hear that you feel that you and he have been making some progress this past week. Just putting this out there....does it really matter if he's not a big social butterfly in a strange situation? He obviously can get it the point where he is confident and comfortable with people and dogs, even if he needs a bit of time to become accustomed to them. He has human and doggie friends who he gets on well with. I think that if I was left in a room with a lady who stared at me a lot and a succession of strange dogs I would probably not eat my Kong either.... It was quite a hard 'test', really. I think that life will be easier once you make further progress with ignoring other dogs on lead. As many of us have said in this thread - we're right there rowing in that same boat But don't worry if he is not going to ever be the life of the party...
