Hello, I've posted over on the puppy thread but hope I can get a bit more insight. My daughter paid a fair bit (£950) for a puppy from a fox red sire and a yellow bitch (her first litter). Both had good hip, elbow and eye scores and the puppy is KC registered. On taking him to his first vets visit for his first jabs, the vet says he's got a sizeable overbite and she wants to remove his canines asap. As the puppy is only 9 weeks, we were advised to get a second opinion from a vet at another practice and he's confirmed an overbite at 9.5mm but he doesn't want to remove the canines for various reasons. Both vets have categorically stated that we shouldn't use him m as a stud dog and we can't show him. They've also confirmed the strong likelihood that his jaws will never ever match. We've told the breeder who doesn't seem convinced of anything we tell them. The stud's owner has said to the breeder that overbite in Labs is rare - is this true? They also appear to have convinced the puppy's breeder that it's the bitch that he's inherited it from - we gather that an animal may be a carrier but not show signs themselves and it can lie dormant for several generations, until the right genetic triggers come into play. So is it possible it's come from the father? The breeder has said that what's happened to this little puppy might make them think about whether they should have another litter from this bitch - is it wise to breed from her again after one puppy with overbite? The breeder says they're wondering whether they should get the remaining puppies from the litter checked out (they're all ready to go to their new owners). - would this be a wise course of action, knowing that their sibling has overbite? The breeder is asking us to take the puppy to their vet for examination - a three hour round trip and he doesn't travel well and gets very stressed. He'll have had three vets examinations in three days and we want to avoid more stress with yet another vet visit, especially to a vet who didn't previously identify the overbite (the vet confirmed to us on the telephone that they'd examined the puppies' mouths and teeth). We don't want to be unreasonable but can't see why he needs to be examined again when two vets have clearly identified the sizeable overbite and they could all just talk to each other! The breeder is not being forthcoming about helping us - can anyone guide us, please?
I should mention that this gorgeous puppy has burrowed his way into our hearts- and that I've been a Labbie owner for over 40 years
The mechanism of inheritance for misaligned teeth is not straightforward. It isn't a case of a single recessive gene that lies hidden until it meets a match. There are probably many genes involved. If both the puppy's parents have properly aligned teeth there is most likely no way of telling how much of the genetic information for the malocclusion came from the mother and how much from the father. And there is probably no way that the breeder could have predicted the problem. Why not get one of the vets that have seen the puppy already to send the breeder's vet a written report. Presumably your vet took photos and measurements. These can all be emailed. Your breeder might need to pay your vet a small fee to do that. Hi there, what is the outcome your daughter is hoping for? Is she wanting compensation to cover vet's bills? Or a replacement puppy?
Accidents of nature can happen. The Bitch may never produce another puppy with a jaw issue or subsequent breedings may reveal a pattern at which point there is no doubt that the issue is with her and she should be removed from a breeding program. At this point, it is simply guesswork to say whether it came from the Sire, the Dam or was an accident of nature. Without a specific genetic test available to determine this, it is unfair to expect the breeder to remove the bitch from her program UNLESS more than one puppy in the litter has the same issue. I am also curious as to whether or not this puppy was purchased to be a "show dog" or to be used in a future breeding program. No breeder worth their salt will promise you that a dog will grow up to be a dog that can win Championships or be bred. There are far too many variables from Hip and Elbow issues to too many faults in conformation; the best that any Breeder can do is to breed responsibly with the knowledge and testing available at the time of the breeding. Even when a Breeder keeps a puppy from their own litter, or the Stud owner gets a "pick of the litter", they are taking on the risk that the puppy will not turn out. What is it you would like the breeder to do? I'm not being snarky, I'm just curious.
