Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

If you want to just use books there are some great ones out there....Pippa's books for the Gundog a Trust graded system are excellent! We started with those before we went to classes before I ever joined the forum and "met" Pippa and everyone else

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

My journey into gundog training was a bit odd - my boy was always a bit "fetch" obsessed, right from the off. Indeed, he had so many balls thrown for him as a puppy,by rights, we should have completely destroyed his desire to chase after a ball. Funny thing was, he always brought everything back then.

Anyway, one summer I was staying in the country and couldn't find a "normal" trainer so went for a 121 with a gundog trainer and it was pretty fab. We mainly did walking nicely, the beginnings of steadiness and so on. But it was lovely to have a structured way to work through things. At this point though, my dog stopped bringing things back! I think it got more exciting for him, doing things "properly".

After that, I got Pippa's books and tried to work through them. I tried a few other trainers, but they were a bit too "traditional" for me. By this point, I really wanted to train my dog using positive only methods, and I struggled to fit in with most gundog trainers. So I went back to the book, and was on my own. With a dog that didn't bring things back! And I did pretty much struggle to solve problems on my own.

When I found a positive only gundog trainer though, it was a massive boost for me. I started to take my clicker training much more seriously. Indeed, started to take training as a whole much more seriously, and got much, much better results.

So, I'd say definitely try with books if that's all you have, but if you can find a trainer that suits you, it really does help. And I love going to class (the thought of going to a class with my mad teenager was terrible, but we did get there in the end).

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

I can't echo enough the importance of the right trainer for what you are hoping to get from it.

I have dabbled in gundog training for a few years with my lab as I managed to organise a trainer to come from 2 hrs away and do group training for a day in our field. However it started to become hard to get people to commit and pay up and consequently left me out of pocket! I then started to look locally but couldn't find one with the type of methods and approach I was looking for. Sadly I found that many gundog trainers really aren't interested unless you want to go out on shoots so I gave up looking.

When I got my spaniel I realised that we would benefit from some training to give me more control out on walks. I don't want my dogs to walk to heel the whole way but needed to learn how to keep my spaniel particularly within a closer area off lead.

I have managed to find a local gundog trainer who doesn't use harsh training methods and completely understood what I wanted from the training. In fact most of his training is done with people who just want a well behaved and under control pet dog!

I think gundog training is a great basis for working bred dogs with the right trainer!
Good luck.

Chloe

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Yes agree with that. My gundog trainer started with sorting Lady out to be a well mannered dog before anything else.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=Rosie link=topic=8109.msg114553#msg114553 date=1412358327]
Hey, amandamummy and Paula - do you want to form the 'Teenage Labradors Anonymous' club? We can just be hugely embarrassed together about our ten-month-old dogs' behaviour....
[/quote]

Yes! Copious amounts of wine and other libations.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Haha, sounds fun. Might make the rest of us want to acquire a teenager just so we can join. Maybe ;D

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Paula, sounds great!! In fact, I have a nice glass of red on hand right now...

[quote author=JulieT link=topic=8109.msg114613#msg114613 date=1412373142]
So, I'd say definitely try with books if that's all you have, but if you can find a trainer that suits you, it really does help. And I love going to class (the thought of going to a class with my mad teenager was terrible, but we did get there in the end).
[/quote]

Yes, I have a book by Lez Graham about training the Pet Gundog and I am thinking of starting on that and just taking things slowly. Actually, we have had a lovely calm day today, I feel so much better than I did a couple of days ago after consulting the forum 8) and really feel positive about things. What's more, Lily can sense it and she is calmer too. I even ignored a sneaky counter surf tonight where she hoovered up an errant french fry (well, it is Saturday) but only rewarded her newly rediscovered 'down' shortly afterwards.

[quote author=rubyrubyruby link=topic=8109.msg114638#msg114638 date=1412408432]
I can't echo enough the importance of the right trainer for what you are hoping to get from it.

I think gundog training is a great basis for working bred dogs with the right trainer!
[/quote]

Chloe, this is vital for me - and I am glad you agree we are moving in the right direction.

[quote author=David link=topic=8109.msg114653#msg114653 date=1412413991]
My gundog trainer started with sorting Lady out to be a well mannered dog before anything else.
[/quote]

Yes yes yes that is what I want!! OK. So now I know what I want, I can go get it I was actually so stressed that I didn't know what to do next.

Thanks all - that's fantastic advice as usual.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=amandamumma link=topic=8109.msg114804#msg114804 date=1412453649]
I have a book by Lez Graham about training the Pet Gundog and I am thinking of starting on that and just taking things slowly.
[/quote]

I'm not a fan of that book - just in case you find yourself struggling with it (you might love it, of course). If you find you don't get on with it, do try Pippa's gundog trust books.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=JulieT link=topic=8109.msg114805#msg114805 date=1412453881]
I'm not a fan of that book - just in case you find yourself struggling with it (you might love it, of course). If you find you don't get on with it, do try Pippa's gundog trust books.
[/quote]

Ah ok - will do... what did you not like about it? Just wondering...

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Partly (well, mainly) she is not positive enough for me - so if the dog doesn't sit, she advises you to "growl" sit and walk "intently" (I would say intimidatingly) towards your dog. Lots of people do this, but it's not for me.

But also, the book jumps too many steps for me, and doesn't tell me what to do if it goes wrong. It says things like "tell your dog to wait, and throw the dummy out in front of you". But wait! What happens when my dog goes nuts at that, strangles himself and then pulls me over! ;D ;D ;D

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

i do feel the pain of what you are all saying millie is nearly 16months and i am still working on several thing walking on a lead loose or at heel is still a complete no no but some things have improve recall was not bad when i got her and we can enjoy a walk in the woods and know she wont run away she says hello to other dogs but comes away if i say this way a very full up muddy puddle good enough to get wet up to top of her legs and more really helps when we are nearly up to where it is i say find the puddle and off she goes hang in there it does improve

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

JulieT - ah yes, I see!

[quote author=JulieT link=topic=8109.msg114816#msg114816 date=1412456262]
But wait! What happens when my dog goes nuts at that, strangles himself and then pulls me over! ;D ;D ;D
[/quote]

That is probably the scenario I would be in with Lily!! I do think that is a bit of a stumbling block; I certainly need to know what to do to correct things if they don't go to plan. I think that is a failing with alot of articles from books and also from trainers in person and online (youtube, for example) who don't guide you if something goes wrong or doesn't happen in the way they say it should/might. There is then the danger of unwittingly doing something wrong, which may affect the training later. I am going to have a good read of the Lez G book and see if I can see it... I had never noticed it before.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=JulieT link=topic=8109.msg114816#msg114816 date=1412456262]
But also, the book jumps too many steps for me, and doesn't tell me what to do if it goes wrong. It says things like "tell your dog to wait, and throw the dummy out in front of you". But wait! What happens when my dog goes nuts at that, strangles himself and then pulls me over! ;D ;D ;D
[/quote]

grab that glass of red! lol ;D

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

I too am going through exactly the same thing with my 10 month old minus the gundog training!
He's like a nipping, jumping, humping over the top excited labrador! I too feel the embarrassment when he runs off to play with other dogs but his recall is somewhat improving if I call him before he gets too close to the other dog otherwise he's off to play/harrass some poor dog. Max hasn't yet learnt what is acceptable yet with other dogs as he's had a few nips of them on his bum.
I have to walk him early in the morning especially if Im home all day if I want to relax or do housework...and in the evening OMG he becomes like a devil dog!!! Doesn't matter how long he has been walked for in the evening as soon as I sit down on the sofa its like "HEY you're not sitting down with me here"...just lately he'll jump up onto the sofa and sit right on top of me!! Big baby or what?!!! He does weigh 30kgs though! Our trainer told us to put a lead on him and hold it under our feet...so no surprise he's chewed threw one!!! His nipping seems to have gone to extremes this past week, i dont know if this has happened with any of you? Saying that today he did settle with my mom!!! Surprise surprise it's starting to work
I see that you too have issues with lead walk, I bought him this new harness (perfect fit) and it does help when he pulls (it has a front D ring) but we use the command "close" and wont walk any further until he's on my left in the heel position, if he pulls ahead again we repeat, after a few times he gets the hang of it unless there's a dog or bird he wants to chase then we have to walk back from where we came. People must think I look insane walking a few steps forward and going back a few steps haha. Its taking Max a while but compared to last month his heelwork has improved
Max also goes to puppy classes once a week which is excellent we've learnt so many new things to try its just finding the time to do them all!!

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Oh how timely this post is. 10 months black labby 28 kg . Still a baby, still a puppy yet looks to others as a grown dog. Today, jumping up on the sofa and climbing all over me, visitor to the house, would not calm down, was so annoying so we put him in the kitchen. I really want him to stop jumping and to be nice to visitors. Although it would help if some visitors did what I ask and pay him no attention. I am unable to walk him as he pulls. I am due for a knee replacement at the end of the month and need him to learn not to jump on me....HELP...

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=Tori_lizzie link=topic=8109.msg115231#msg115231 date=1412627815]
Max hasn't yet learnt what is acceptable yet with other dogs as he's had a few nips of them on his bum.
I have to walk him early in the morning especially if Im home all day if I want to relax or do housework...and in the evening OMG he becomes like a devil dog!!!

Max also goes to puppy classes once a week which is excellent we've learnt so many new things to try its just finding the time to do them all!!

[/quote]

I am so glad you have found a good class - I never felt comfortable at classes as Lily was always the most exuberant dog there! She is definitely the same as Max in that she hasn't learnt manners with other dogs; her pal Benji is constantly harassed and wrestled with until he gives her a few nips and then she might consider stopping. I sometimes think she is a bit daft! HOW MANY times does she have to be nipped before she gets the message? : Also, I find the early walk on the days I don't work the only way to get any peace at all during the day. Also, in the evening she does go a bit bananas - she did it this evening. She bared her teeth a bit, too!! What a monkey. I sent her into the garden to cool off. Then after 5 mins she started to nibble the french doors (NOOOOOO!!) Where's that glass of red?? ;D

[quote author=Elaineh link=topic=8109.msg115386#msg115386 date=1412701200]
I am due for a knee replacement at the end of the month and need him to learn not to jump on me....HELP...
[/quote]

Hi Elaine, I have looked at this you tube video from kikopup that has an idea of how to stop jumping up. I am not sure how this would work with Lily but I am going to give it a go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC_OKgQFgzw

Also, I was looking online for a 'worse case scenario' trainer to come in if things get too bad - I am not sure where you live but there are dog trainers/behaviourists who will come to your home and help to resolve your jumping up issue?? I only say this as you sound as if you have some pressing challenges what with your knee problem. I am not sure how much it costs. Also, I must warn you, I am a novice dog owner and there are LOTS more people on here who will be able to advise you better - including Pippa's own training materials on the labrador site, so that is worth looking at.

In a new development, we have decided to put Lily in doggy daycare on a Mon and Tues when I'm at work as OH can't work and keep an eye on Lily at the same time as she is so tricky at the moment. I think it is best for everyone - she gets to have an exciting day and gets some basic obedience training, a long walk, rest in her kennel and some agility too. On the downside she comes home a bit muddy and smells like a farmyard (it is in the sticks!) but I am hoping she'll get a lot out of it.

Fingers crossed.

But it has been a stressful day.

I keep thinking WE WILL GET THROUGH THIS...

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

So wonderful to read these posts and realise we have passed that stage!!!! Yes, it does happen! A friend always said, "At two years old he will calm down, I promise." And he did!

I heard from someone who works at a shelter that most dogs are abandoned are at 8 months old cos they've grown big but are still unruly and therefore difficult to handle.

We turned the corner when we found a positive-only dog school. We'd been at a school for 1.5 years that made you shout at your dog if he lay down when he was supposed to be sitting, or broke his stay, and you can imagine, with an exuberant boy who loved to socialise and play more than anything else, I would leave class each week feeling depressed, a failure. In fact, one trainer pointed out that my dog had not improved at all -- "Not like the other dogs in the class", she said. I agree with an earlier comment about dog ownership feeling like a test. The best thing we did was leave the "harsh" dog school and find a trainer who didn't compare our dog with anyone else's and who said the most important thing was building a trusting relationship between us and our dog, not about having a trained dog -- RCT, relationship-centred training (many articles on this on the internet). There's no point sending your dog away to a trainer to get "trained" because she must want to please you, not someone else. Someone mentioned getting their dog to lie down as a good behaviour. Great advice! We taught our boy that sitting was his best behaviour. So sweet now when he sits and his tail is wagging madly when he wants to show you how good he is, particularly when people come to visit and he wants attention, so he sits.

He is now 2.5 years old and the most wonderful dog you can imagine, with the odd misdemeanour (jumps up on my nephew from excitement, races down the road to say hallo to a dog when we are trying to call him back). I miss those mad puppy years though when he'd tear around the house and skid on the rug. Enjoy them while you've got them!

Oh, and regarding occupying her at home: we also changed to raw food -- a nice big meaty bone exhausted him and saved our furniture.

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

I too am a fully paid up member of the teenage lab club- I feel your pain! I won't list all of things that I was stressing about- it would take too long ;D But I did realise that I was spending more time stressing about things rather than having fun so I took a two stage approach. First- stop worrying (well try too) and second find some fun things to do with Molly. We started doing a flyball class and Molly loves it- the emphasis is on relaxed fun and everyone at the club is a really nice person. Plus everyone at flyball is used to having dogs barking- so the fact that Molly is going through a barky phase doesn't matter, I could just ignore her and not feel embarrassed. Joy! We're also having a go at agility....

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

Oh hooray, another Flyballer!!!

 

Re: Still displaying same puppy behaviours at 10 mths - what's going on?

[quote author=Oberon link=topic=8109.msg114561#msg114561 date=1412359712]
The basic weapon in our armory was really heavily and frequently rewarding him for lying down, so we could get him to lie down as an alternative to all the other annoying, noisy and painful behaviours. Anytime he lay down he got a treat. We also put it on cue so we could get it anytime. It became his default behaviour - if he wanted something he'd lie down. Training one thing like that helped as it was really clear and consistent for him. He got what he wanted (treat, attention) by asking in an acceptable way.

[/quote]

Well, we are having a go at this... and - it seems to be working! It is becoming her 'default behaviour' whenever she wants something or to show me she is being a good girl. We can even eat pizza on our knees on a Friday night and she will come and lay by me in her sphinx position ;D as if to say "looklooklook at me!! I am being sooooooo gooood!" and she is calm and shows she does have (with the right motivation...) some control over herself - which is really good news.

Thank you again for the words of wisdom, as always

One question: when you say you 'put it on cue', what exactly do you do? Is it just a case of saying 'down' like normal training and she just does it?