So, we know now what the stop whistle means. And we know it means "stop, sit, look at me" wherever you are. Today we were trying to move to introducing some distractions. The distraction was supposed to be interesting smells in a field full of rabbits, badgers, fox poo and other such delicacies - the farmer had helpfully pointed the field out as the kind of place I was looking for (the farmer trains spaniels, so I guess he knows). My ambition was to wait until Charlie was distracted by something and blow the stop whistle. Here I am failing to get Charlie to be distracted. Every time I'm about to blow the stop whistle, he sits and looks at me - I must be making a noise, or have particular "about to blow the stop whistle" body language! This happens about 10 times... https://www.flickr.com/photos/97932779@N08/14391210990/ Eventually, we manage to get interested in some smelly stuff, and see if our stop whistle works, which it does. He rarely gets recalled on the stop whistle, by the way. https://www.flickr.com/photos/97932779@N08/14577186652/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/97932779@N08/14576203774/ Time to move on to something more challenging, I think. I'll have to get the books out again....what's next for the stop whistle? I need to develop a programme here, I think.
Re: Stop whistle That's looking pretty fab! ;D What next.....Tricky as all my options rely on Riley getting a ball or a retrieve as his reward......are you happy for that? As Charlie is coming towards you either naturally or with a bit of encouragement make as if you're throwing a ball and blow your stop whistle. When he stops he gets the ball. I also did stop whistles before my directional work so if the dog was already sat and I was a little way in front of the dog I would blow my stop whistle to reinforce the sit before casting him back, left or right. If you're doing any directional stuff anyway it's easy to pop some of that in. There's the lost retrieve which is where the dog thinks there's a dummy down but there isn't. When they stop you throw another dummy for them to retrieve. I didn't use this much as Riley's drive was fragile and I wanted him to alway believe there was a dummy there, you probably won't have that problem. There's the stolen retrieve which is where the dummy is out and an assistant stops the dog getting the dummy if they don't stop, reward is another thrown dummy. You can use a memory, drop the dummy, about turn, leave the dog sitting and walk away. Recall the dog, stop whistle, when he stops send him back for the dummy. This may be too much for Charlie's steadiness right now. Or you can recall the dog through two dummies (one left and one right) stop him in the middle and send him one way or the other. I think that list pretty much goes in terms of difficulty (for us anyway). Let me know if any of that doesn't make sense. You will probably need someone more expert for actual advice though, this is just a list of the options we've used ;D
Re: Stop whistle That looks great! Is there a thread anywhere where you describe how you get to this point? Molly is pretty reliable now about recall so I'd like to be able to do a stop.
Re: Stop whistle That's great! Thanks so much! Charlie can have a dummy reward for the stop whistle - from time to time. I have to be able to construct it such that I can send him to the dummy from the stop (which isn't always easy as we haven't done directional stuff - I'll have to think about when to do that, I'm dying to get on with it). For the last couple of days, I've had him close, so it was easy to send him to a dummy (down a path) that he hadn't seen me drop. Once he knew stop whistle = retrieve, the distance he is away from me when I blow the stop whistle doesn't seem to matter at all. I guess it might, when/if the stop whistle stops meaning retrieve. He also seems to find a recall quite rewarding, which I know sound daft, but a recall means "come get a lovely treat and then go off to play again", so he seems happy enough with that.
Re: Stop whistle [quote author=Joy link=topic=6871.msg93366#msg93366 date=1404556118] That looks great! Is there a thread anywhere where you describe how you get to this point? Molly is pretty reliable now about recall so I'd like to be able to do a stop. [/quote] It's very good fun to train! There are articles and videos on the site - I'll look them out for you and post links to them here. Give me a mo (my coffee is ready!). If you haven't already got them, the gundog trust beginner books are fab too.
Re: Stop whistle If it was me I might be tempted to try a lost retrieve, you don't need any directional work established or a helper and he's so keen that actually realising the only way to get a dummy is to listen to you would be good for him.......just my inexperienced opinion though I wasn't sure how his leg would be for a back command, it's quite a twist but if you want to make a start it's the easiest thing to begin. Find a corridor, do a memory but sit him down facing away from the dummy walk away and send him back, his enthusiasm will do the rest ;D Otherwise pop him on a fence line facing out and put a dummy out to one side and start doing lefts and rights. Always try and find straight lines to help him and don't make it too hard in terms of cover or distance while you establish what the commands really mean. Make your physical signals big and clear, subtlety is for later ;D
Re: Stop whistle One other thing, you might want to do your lost retrieve into a corner so Charlie can't go hunting too far.....if he gets his hunting head on, convinced there's a dummy out there his ears might not work ;D
Re: Stop whistle Thanks! I'll sit down and work through it this afternoon. It's so good to be training again! You are so right about his ears failing! If he is looking for a dummy he is deaf! I'm starting to make him realise that sometimes I know where the dummy is though. He just glances up and carries on hunting. "What? What? Can't you see I'm looking for my dummy?!?! What? It's over there? Why didn't you say!". ;D ;D ;D [quote author=bbrown link=topic=6871.msg93370#msg93370 date=1404556817] I wasn't sure how his leg would be for a back command, it's quite a twist [/quote] This is tricky, I'll have a think about that. I've mainly been sticking to blinds in corridors, where he goes a bit slower than if he can see the dummy - looking for it, I guess. And this stops any mad overruns and slamming on of the brakes. If the dummy is in cover, it's also fine. Although he's very bouncy and pouncy to get to where he thinks it is, he is also looking for it, which slows him down. Memories and seens (unless into water) are a bit difficult and invite somersault failures to stop at the dummy... Lefts and rights would be fun though!
Re: Stop whistle If you want to try and prevent over runs it might help to send him into the wind so that he can smell the dummy a little way out rather than getting past it before a whiff turns him round. Think about the wind when you're setting up your exercise. Also use some natural barriers so that he can't over run, they may help slow him down before he crashes into a hedge - no guarantees though LOL
Re: Stop whistle Yes, good points - thanks. I need to work out what I'm doing a bit more carefully. So much to do!
Re: Stop whistle [quote author=Joy link=topic=6871.msg93366#msg93366 date=1404556118] That looks great! Is there a thread anywhere where you describe how you get to this point? Molly is pretty reliable now about recall so I'd like to be able to do a stop. [/quote] Hi there Joy, here is the link to get you started: http://totallygundogs.com/introduction-to-stop-whistle-training/
Re: Stop whistle I don't think I've anything else to add to what Barbara has suggested. Those are the exercises we use. On the subject of him guessing your going to blow your whistle I have my whistle in my mouth all the time when I'm doing stop whistle practise so they don't guess I'm about to peep.
Re: Stop whistle This is where we are at at the moment...quite a challenge but fun! http://totallygundogs.com/stop-whistle-2-whistle-sit-on-the-move/
Re: Stop whistle Wow Julie,you should be dead proud to be able to post videos like that....brilliant!keep them coming when as you work through your training program x
Re: Stop whistle You have done a great job on the the videos and getting Charlie to stop, Imo don't recall him from a stop to often it will form a habit. You need him to work on a right, left or back, not coming toward you after a stop. That he can do that very well If you want to move on to a retrieve from a stop, throw a dummy over your shoulder if he makes a move to get it you can intervene and blow the stop again, then release him to get it. Directional work needs to done at a short range to start with, no more than 10yds, then build up slowly.
Re: Stop whistle [quote author=Dexter link=topic=6871.msg93395#msg93395 date=1404574054] Wow Julie,you should be dead proud to be able to post videos like that....brilliant!keep them coming when as you work through your training program x [/quote] Ah, thanks! To be honest, this progress is a bit of a surprise. We hadn't got very far with the stop whistle before Charlie was injured. But then it was something we could do on a long line when he started getting a bit more freedom. Add in a retrieve reward and it all works rather well.
Re: Stop whistle [quote author=Beanwood link=topic=6871.msg93393#msg93393 date=1404572518] This is where we are at at the moment...quite a challenge but fun! http://totallygundogs.com/stop-whistle-2-whistle-sit-on-the-move/ [/quote] Brill - do some vids if you can, be great to have a bit of a stop whistle training company!
Re: Stop whistle Lovely to see Charlie running free and well done with the stop whistle; like the others I would throw a tennis ball as reward, rather than call him towards you too often as he may then begin to anticipate and think stop means ' stop and recall'. When are you having the gundog lessons? I think you have done enormously well with him in a short time.
